News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by jqpabc123 on Tuesday October 14, 2025 @05:51PM (#45585474)
"No one gets paid until something get's sold".

I heard this from management over and over again during my engineering career.

It never occurred to them that nothing gets sold until something get's built. They took this part for granted.

The more pertinent question is why does American business culture emphasize and reward sales more than engineering?

In other words, how do you logically explain why the guy who sells the product gets a share of the revenue but the guy who built it doesn't?

Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by rawgabbit on Tuesday October 14, 2025 @07:30PM (#45586234)
Because the decision makers do not make their choice on a purely rational basis. Usually the deal was already agreed to through back channels. Then comes the dog and pony show where they shop for some cost-benefit analysis or pay a consultant or just plain lie to justify their decision.
Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by jqpabc123 on Wednesday October 15, 2025 @07:55AM (#45591034)
American management is really a cult.

There are members and outcasts.

Members are rewarded and nurtured. Outcasts are restricted, controlled and overruled. In American business society, engineering will forever be an outcast --- not because it's logical but because it's a tradition --- one that the cult rarely breaks.

Outcasts are rarely allowed to voice an opinion (Example: Boeing). The overall structure is really descended from the plantation system which is a variation of the even older feudal system.

The only real escape for an outcast --- start your own business --- which I did decades ago.

Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by floxy on Tuesday October 14, 2025 @06:04PM (#45585607)
>nothing gets sold until something gets built.

Unfortunately, plenty of vaporware gets sold.

Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by rufus_foreman on Tuesday October 14, 2025 @08:13PM (#45586530)
[delayed]
Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by agcat on Wednesday October 15, 2025 @01:22PM (#45595774)
Yeah I have seen this. I hope there were better ways to restrict this from happening
Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by ibfreeekout on Tuesday October 14, 2025 @06:00PM (#45585578)
Not to mention the folks that support it dealing with the front line grunt work being paid peanuts by comparison to the sales bonuses.
Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by agcat on Wednesday October 15, 2025 @01:32PM (#45595903)
Sorry did not get who are these people who deal with the front line grunt work? Support/engineers?
Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by agcat on Wednesday October 15, 2025 @01:20PM (#45595749)
That’s a fair question. What I have seen is that engineers are rewarded way more in equity than salespeople. Is that true?
Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by jqpabc123 on Wednesday October 15, 2025 @01:31PM (#45595901)
engineers are rewarded way more in equity than salespeople

The only time I have seen this is with startups --- where they are cash strapped so engineers building the new product are given *equity* instead of wages.

Equity can be created simply by issuing stock --- which for a startup with negative cash flow is basically worthless at the time.

This is highly risky for the employee. If the product/company is wildly successful, early employees can get rich. But most startups fail --- so more often, they're left with nothing to show for their work.

Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by agcat on Wednesday October 15, 2025 @01:35PM (#45595942)
Yeah the downside is huge. I hope there was a way to reward engineering teams too for sales commission.. have you come across any company that doso?
Re:Ask HN: Why do engineers hate salespeople? by jqpabc123 on Wednesday October 15, 2025 @02:03PM (#45596317)
No, I have never seen engineering get sales commissions.

I have seen sales people get *recurring* commissions --- where they get a piece of every future sale to a particular client. Even if they have no involvement in the purchase. In extreme cases, they make good money doing nothing.

Engineers never get paid for doing nothing --- because they are not members of the ruling class.