News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by infecto on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @09:12AM (#42710949)
Then be prepared to be surprised? I don't know why its better but it actually is night and day different. The best uneducated way I can describe it is YouTube sticks you into a model that only classifies people in large groups. Oh you watch video game streamers, you may like this alt-right talking heads. TikTok has a model that is tailored just for you. Oh you like video game streamers that play Tarkov? Here are some videos of other games similar to Tarkov.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by robertlagrant on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @09:39AM (#42711255)
I don't think I've ever seen the alt right on YouTube, but maybe that's the mystery of the algorithm. Or of the definition of "alt right".
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by infecto on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @10:21AM (#42711846)
Or more likely, just a mystery for yourself.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by tumsfestival on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @10:34AM (#42712068)
Then you either curate your feed very well or you don't use YouTube at all. Spend a couple of days indiscriminately watching whatever slop the algorithm recommends and you'll start seeing some eyebrow raising content.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by PittleyDunkin on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @10:14AM (#42711758)
This is honestly kind of shocking. Do you just avoid looking up any kind of political video?
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by robertlagrant on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @10:55AM (#42712432)
No, I watch political videos, but nothing as far to the right as the alt right, I don't think. Maybe once?
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by myko on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @12:23PM (#42713940)
I'm surprised. I've been blocking Jordan Peterson videos for years from YouTube, and I still get recommended something with him in it weekly. I also don't watch political videos generally on the platform.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by Sohcahtoa82 on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @02:44PM (#42715940)
I wonder what you're watching to make YouTube think you want to see it.

I don't see Jordan Peterson or any of those right-wing videos in my suggestions at all.

I just went to my front page, and everything there is stuff I'm interested in. There's the latest clip from a Hell's Kitchen episode, a Gamers Nexus video, an aviation incident with ATC recordings, a video from Fully Ramblomatic (game reviewer), a video on how to to use a cable comb and why you'd want to, a LockPickingLawyer video, videos related to MS Flight Simulator, mountain biking, Factorio, Technology Connections, Adam Savage's Tested...

There is literally not a single suggested video that I wouldn't be interested in in the first 3 pages of my YouTube front page.

So when people complain that YouTube is constantly suggesting right-wing content, brainrot, and MrBeast, I don't know what the hell they're talking about.

Heck, I watch Legal Eagle, which gets pretty political, and yet I don't get basically any political content suggestions.

Are you guys not logged in or something? Constantly browsing from incognito windows?

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by myko on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @04:12PM (#42717080)
I'm logged in.

I let YouTube remember my history indefinitely. I've never been recommended MrBeast (and only recently-ish heard of him, the last year or so). Maybe years ago, I watched some clips of Joe Rogan if they popped up, but I've never been a regular listener.

My earlier comment shouldn't have been so down on YouTube - overall, my recommendations are good. But it does concern me that the algorithm consistently tries to push Peterson on me.

I do watch a lot of sports commentary and breakdowns, maybe that leads down the path to Peterson?

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by swatcoder on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @04:55PM (#42717662)
Just from your summary, your viewing habits put out vivid, clear signals that you like commercialized hobbies like gaming and mountain biking.

Not everybody telegraphs how to get into their wallet as well as you do!

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by spogbiper on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @01:56PM (#42715351)
youtube is utterly convinced i want to see videos of people using vintage synthesizers to recreate modern songs. i have been telling it i'm not interested in this for months, like actively trying to correct whatever is happening there. they always come back.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by robertlagrant on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @04:46PM (#42717555)
Jordan Peterson isn't the alt right, though. Why would he be relevant?
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by myko on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @04:51PM (#42717626)
Giving you the benefit of the doubt with this comment, I recommend googling their relationship with the alt right
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by robertlagrant on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @06:54PM (#42718983)
Sorry - I might not be following, but I don't know who they are. No worries either way, but if you're able to provide something to read I'd be happy to. Googling something, especially with modern Google, doesn't guarantee I'll get to the article you're thinking of.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by Dylan16807 on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @10:35PM (#42720813)
> I don't know who they are.

"they" in that sentence was Jordan Peterson.

> the article you're thinking of

There's plenty of articles to find.

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by robertlagrant on Thursday January 16, 2025 @04:20AM (#42723196)
I agree there are articles, but that's tricky, I think. E.g. this article[0] says "...having amassed a substantial alt-right following...", but it's unsubstantiated.

I can't tell if it's just placed in articles to get people to believe it or if it's true. How big is the alt-right? Is 100 people on the alt-right a substantial alt-right following? How big is that following compared to his overall following size? Is this just the same logic as "You think snow is white? Did you know Adolf Hitler thought snow was white?"?

As a meta-point, I understand that uninquiring minds don't want to know, and you can get a long way by defining yourself by people you don't like. But I genuinely do want to know, or at least ask the question, and if Bernie Sanders were constantly tarred with "Has a substantial following in the KKK community" I'd be asking the same thing: how many people is that, and how many is it of the total people who like him?

[0] https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/books/news/...

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by Dylan16807 on Thursday January 16, 2025 @12:15PM (#42728055)
Glancing at the top results I think this one has a solid view on how the connection gets close, even if I think it's too nice to him. https://heterodoxacademy.org/blog/social-science-jordan-pete...
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by infecto on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @10:21AM (#42711857)
If you look at his most recent comment history you can see a trend of either being a troll or an unaware/aware jerk. Not entirely surprising.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by PittleyDunkin on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @11:24AM (#42712956)
Yea, this definitely explains the comment.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by HeyLaughingBoy on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @01:24PM (#42714911)
I found your comment surprising. I have literally never even considered looking for political videos online. They're enough of them shoved in my face everywhere I turn without me needing to seek them out.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by mh- on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @02:49PM (#42716015)
I've also never gotten those sort of YT recommendations, and that is exactly what I do. I never click links to political videos. My entire recommended section is full of stuff from channels I've watched before, or very close to it.
Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by pjc50 on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @09:14AM (#42710966)
> you watch video game streamers, you may like this alt-right talking heads

This is something that infuriates me about youtube, to the extent that I wonder if it's deliberate. Those guys feel like the propaganda the platform wants to sell me, whereas on the Chinese platforms there isn't the sense of HERE IS THE TWO MINUTE HATE PROPAGANDA VIDEO CITIZEN you sometimes get on other platforms.

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by infecto on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @09:27AM (#42711114)
I wonder if its simply just a pattern over the last N years with Google where they maximize everything for ad revenue. I honestly don't know how TikToks ad revenue looks like but from a consumer point of view it appears for whatever reason they have mostly corporate ads where YouTube has the lowest value garbage (perhaps highest paying) ads on MLM and getting rich through real estate.

Edit: As a weak comparison I think about Prime Streaming vs YouTube or Hulu. Ignoring that ads suck. Prime gives you a handful of various ads of real products/companies and have done in my opinion a smart job of minimizing the consumers negativity toward it. YouTube throws whatever highest paying garbage at you as much as possible. I tried Hulu once with ads, painful, every like 7mins you are getting an ad and often the same ad over and over.

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by PittleyDunkin on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @10:15AM (#42711770)
It's also worth noting that TikTok has the "TikTok Shop" that allows people to sell directly through the app. Perhaps this allows them to rely less heavily on advertising. I certainly see virtually zero ads on the app. Ideally this is because they've identified that I'm a terrible person to sell ads to, but perhaps they're just less aggressive about pushing them.

> Prime gives you a handful of various ads of real products/companies and have done in my opinion a smart job of minimizing the consumers negativity toward it.

Sure, I just stopped using prime when they introduced ads. It's also the number one complaint about the service and it regularly shows up any time the service is mentioned. I also can't remember a single ad played that was actually relevant to me.

Curiously, I hear this less about Hulu despite them being equivalently bad in my experience. Perhaps hulu has better content.

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by jacobgkau on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @04:47PM (#42717574)
> Curiously, I hear this less about Hulu despite them being equivalently bad in my experience. Perhaps hulu has better content.

I feel like Hulu established early enough that they were partially (or fully) ad-supported. I watched a show for free on Hulu with ads many years before I ever would have considered paying for a streaming service at all. Prime, on the other hand, is something people already pay for (usually for reasons other than just streaming, but that also reinforces that they're paying), so the ads probably come off as worse because of that, even though it's kind of backwards in some ways.

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by ryandrake on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @07:52PM (#42719515)
Yea, I commented[1] on this exact observation yesterday, right down to the two topics. It's absurd what gets highlighted as "suggestions."

1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42699541

Re:TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday by paganel on Wednesday January 15, 2025 @01:20PM (#42714864)
Reminder that YT used to be pretty decent about (music) recommendations until, I’d say, 2015-ish, that’s how I discovered lots and lots of very cool and interesting (music) stuff that I listen to this day.

Not sure how they managed to screw that up, but screw it they did, and nowadays the sidebar, or even the plain search, has become unusable.