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Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by bostik on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @02:46PM (#40588745)
And let's keep in mind that the term "Public Relations" was explicitly chosen as a Newspeak-term because Edward Bernays realised that the actual term for a war time methodology, "propaganda", was too loaded.[0] And honest.

Internet is a communications medium. It was destined to be flooded with propaganda, whatever you try to call your particular flavour.

Or as I have been saying since the 1990's, the only difference between marketing and propaganda is that with marketing at least you are trying to peddle a product instead of an ideology.

0: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays

Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by dylan604 on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @02:56PM (#40588880)
> "propaganda", was too loaded.[0] And honest.

Quite often I default to the word propaganda when talking about anyone's PR campaigns in my own personal battle with trying to undo this. I ratchet it up when talking directly to marketing/PR people. Pretty much every time I'm just looked at as yet another crazy person.

Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by netsharc on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @03:43PM (#40589589)
My brain just came up with the phrase "You can't spell propaganda without PR", which I think is clever. But I'm going to put it into a search engine now and see that it's not original...
Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by trogdor on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @04:36PM (#40590274)
You also can’t spell propaganda without pagan. I wonder what that means.
Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by defrost on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @08:35PM (#40592204)
That once again, as always it seems, no one is talking about the Panda Gap.

Literally the raison d'etre of PR | propaganda is to distract, to replace, to (in modern terms) throw a dead cat on the table and have everybody talk about that.

Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by Terr_ on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @02:55PM (#40588866)
> Or as I have been saying since the 1990's, the only difference between marketing and propaganda is that with marketing at least you are trying to peddle a product instead of an ideology.

I disagree, ideologies are often already in there, even when they are simplistic "power-tools are for men and all men require power-tools", or "having better stuff than your neighbors is a virtue, failing to do so will lead to dangerous ostracization."

Very tame "Our blender spins twice as fast as the competition" marketing might be arguably free of ideology, but that's a decreasing minority.

Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by shiroiushi on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @10:50PM (#40592916)
>I disagree, ideologies are often already in there, even when they are simplistic "power-tools are for men and all men require power-tools"

I disagree. This isn't peddling an ideology, it's using an existing ideology (or stereotype) in order to peddle a product. A company with a marketing campaign targeting men isn't going to refuse to sell power tools to women, they're just designing their marketing campaign in a way they think will maximize sales overall, using existing biases and ideologies that potential customers already have. Normal companies don't care about ideology unless it helps them make more money, which is their true goal.

Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by ab5tract on Thursday June 06, 2024 @04:38AM (#40595008)
What you have described is, in fact, a mode of perpetuating ideology. If what you awere saying were accurate, it would absolve all capitalistic endeavors of reinforcing ideology, even the essential ideology of capitalism inherent in those endeavors.

That’s not how this works. “The medium is the message,” as Marshall McLuhan would say.

A woman may never consider buying power tools because of the imagery of the propaganda surrounding power tools. Or the salesman may undermine, intimidate, or otherwise obstruct her attempts to purchase one. But regardless your point falls apart because the ideology of capitalism underlying the power tools on the shelf subsumes the ideology of the advertising.

That subsumption, however, does not in any way contraindicate those ideologies present in the advertisement’s framing. It only demonstrates that money is more important than the other ideologies being peddled.

Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by chimpanzee on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @03:01PM (#40588941)
> the only difference between marketing and propaganda is that with marketing at least you are trying to peddle a product instead of an ideology

Marketing often includes the peddling of an ideology as a foundation for the product buying, especially for big-ticket items. (One buys the product that fits and signals one’s ideology.) To me, this makes marketing even more insidious as we often focus on the product rather than the message. Think Ford, Tesla, Apple …

Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by squarefoot on Thursday June 06, 2024 @02:43AM (#40594287)
> Think Ford, Tesla, Apple

And guns.

Re:Israel Faked Social Media Accounts to Garner Support from... by torpid on Wednesday June 05, 2024 @08:26PM (#40592147)
The Century of the Self documentary by Adam Curtis does an incredible job of covering that and is well-worth the watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnPmg0R1M04

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Century_of_the_Self