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Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nebula8804 on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @01:11PM (#40147071)
>China and other countries do far worse to us than just requiring local ownership of businesses; and if they feel that is in their national interest, why can’t we return the favor when we feel it’s in our interest?

This is bigger than China for a lot of people. TikTok has given an alternative voice to groups typically marginalized on pro-Western platforms. We typically see hypocrisy from the West when it comes to Israel and current times are no different. Tiktok has allowed nearly more access to whatever footage is capable of sneaking out of the warzone whereas Meta platforms tend to suppress. (ex: they recently auto-defaulted a restriction on political content without informing their users).

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by slowmovintarget on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @02:08PM (#40147715)
TikTok amplifies whatever is in China's interest to amplify. Today, it happens to be voices opposed to Israel. Tomorrow, it could easily be the opposite. The goal is to generate geopolitical chaos to veil other actions (Taiwan, South China sea, Chinese migrant injections into Panama...).

A society's strength comes from its unity of will and resolve. Social media can be used to attack that unity... and has, not just by China.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by coldtea on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @02:34PM (#40147968)
>TikTok amplifies whatever is in China's interest to amplify.

So just like the other platforms, but for China instead of the US? (aka: "It's bad when you do it, not when we do it").

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by Aloha on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @02:40PM (#40148013)
I dont know that I would be making that claim about other platforms - there is something unique, pervasive and opaque about TikTok and how they try to drive engagement.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by slowmovintarget on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @02:42PM (#40148026)
That's putting words in my mouth.

All social media with attention management may be weaponized and has generally proven to be unhealthy for society. TikTok happens to be actively worse for a number of reasons, one of them being that it is designed to be so.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by Workaccount2 on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @03:50PM (#40148772)
If Biden wants instagram to show you pictures of ponies, the best he can do is go to congress and get funding to run an ad campaign on instagram to show people ponies.

If Xi wants to show you ponies, you'll see them all over tiktok tomorow.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by arandomusername on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @06:34PM (#40150679)
That's not really true. https://reason.com/2023/07/28/biden-white-house-pressured-fa...

One exmaple of many. If Biden doesn't want you seeing something, the white house will put pressure on social media companies to censor it.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by wumeow on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @08:38PM (#40151779)
The difference is Meta was free to refuse, and did in some cases. False equivalence.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by arandomusername on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @09:34PM (#40152280)
"We were under pressure from the administration and others to do more. We shouldn't have done it."

Also: The 5th Circuit panel found that the White House coerced the platforms through “intimidating messages and threats of adverse consequences” and commandeered the decision-making processes of social media companies, particularly in handling pandemic-related and 2020 election posts.

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/money/2023/09/08/biden-adminis...

To say they were free to refuse is disingeneous.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by wumeow on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @10:21PM (#40152604)
Yes, pressure is not the same as coercion. The 5th circuit is a notorious conservative circus show, I’ll wait for the Supreme Court’s decision.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by arandomusername on Thursday April 25, 2024 @08:20AM (#40156601)
How is "threats of adverse consequences" any different than what China does?

If a cartel member comes up to you and tells you to give him your wallet or there might be "consequences", do you think you are free to refuse him?

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by Workaccount2 on Thursday April 25, 2024 @09:37AM (#40157411)
The US government has pressured various private orgs since forever to do stuff. Lots of stories about helping, refusals, court cases, retaliation. It's not much different than what goes on daily in the business world. Everyone will try to use their power to get their way.

However, this is contrary to China, who has never really pressured any Chinese organization to do anything. This is because they don't need to use pressure. They can just do it. Because there is no concept of "private organization" in China. The state has all the power.

It's so tellingly naive when people try to equivocate the US to China.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by asadotzler on Thursday April 25, 2024 @12:13AM (#40153348)
Yes, and when our government does it, we can hold them accountable. When an adversarial foreign power does it we cannot. Is that a difficult concept for you?
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by ergocoder on Thursday April 25, 2024 @12:43AM (#40153511)
Yes, we will try hard to equate US government and China government. The 2 governments are so fungible and have equivalent due process for everything, especially for US citizens and citizens in other countries with border disputes. lol I can't even.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by megous on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @07:33PM (#40151263)
Israel can generate chaos on its own quite well, thank you.

About one half (!) of all UNGA emergency special sessions are about its conflicts, for crying out loud. :) This nothingcountry of <10 million people entertains the whole UN for the last 80 years or so almost constantly.

The world has grown by 4 billion people during that time, lol. Most of that time social media did not even exist.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by Aloha on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @02:43PM (#40148031)
I'm not seeing any issue with those voices finding a space elsewhere say on X/Twitter - believe me, I see enough of the slop over from it.

The level of direct control the US Government has over US Social Media platforms pales in comparison to the control China has over TikTok.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nebula8804 on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @04:33PM (#40149241)
Why not both? As it stands X platform is run by a pathological liar that has cozied up to the ADL to get the activist Pro-Israel community off his back. Many users many not prefer to use that platform because of these issues. The more options for people the better. What people seem to be forgetting is that TikTok is not the only market player. To single them out is absurd in this context.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nemothekid on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @05:07PM (#40149649)
Saying the word "cis" is enough to catch a ban on Twitter. Somehow in America, uncensored only means that far right white supremacists can say n**er freely.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by zeroonetwothree on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @05:39PM (#40150031)
After all there’s even a scotus case this term about the government merely “suggesting” that social media act a certain way.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by hhjinks on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @04:19PM (#40149065)
>TikTok has given an alternative voice to groups typically marginalized on pro-Western platforms

This has to be substantiated, because it seems blatantly absurd on its face. Are you saying TikTok is an anti-western platform? That, in and of itself, justifies the divestment, considering the owner, no? Furthermore, what "pro-western" platforms are you talking about? I haven't seen anything from TikTok that wouldn't fly on discord or reddit, for example.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nemothekid on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @05:10PM (#40149699)
>I haven't seen anything from TikTok that wouldn't fly on discord or reddit, for example.

You only need to compare TikTok to it's US rival Reels. A majority of the pro-palestine is suppressed on Reels. The loss of TikTok is the destruction of Americans to access content that isn't filtered through US hegemony.

[1] https://www.hrw.org/report/2023/12/21/metas-broken-promises/...

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by hhjinks on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @05:35PM (#40149987)
> The loss of TikTok is the destruction of Americans to access content that isn't filtered through US hegemony.

Meta's arcane moderation decisions apply to other platforms than their own? Go to reddit, to youtube, or to twitter, and you can find the most vile, unfiltered opinions on Israel and Palestine known to man.

Americans aren't missing out on any content at all. The only thing that will be destroyed is China's fast lane to American eyes.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nashashmi on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @06:11PM (#40150445)
Try posting something on israel and palestine. it will get less views. Try doing a post like good morning. it will get more views!
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by hhjinks on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @06:25PM (#40150592)
The Israel/Palestine conflict is routinely at the top of massive subs like /r/news and /r/worldnews, two subreddits with diametrically opposed views on the conflict.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nashashmi on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @06:55PM (#40150884)
The channels are a different story. The dealbreaker is when that comes up on your newsfeed. It creates reactions.

My feed is repeatedly missing these things. And then i have to manually revisit them. It starts up again. And then ceases.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by asadotzler on Thursday April 25, 2024 @12:15AM (#40153356)
So what you're saying is those who control the feed algo have all the power and you want China to control the feed algo for a popular US app. Sounds smart /s
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nashashmi on Thursday April 25, 2024 @03:27AM (#40154537)
US wants to control the feed algo. TikTok said no. US wants TikTok sold to someone who will.

So far, China doesn’t control the feed algo. They control what content is uploaded. Imagine putting work into a video yet it never seeing the light because it was shadow banned. Now imagine it not allowed to be seen. The former is the western world. The latter is china.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by valec on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @06:10PM (#40150433)
are you serious? reddit is perhaps the most astroturfed platform on the planet.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by hhjinks on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @06:23PM (#40150574)
Please, for the love of God, can people please stop making me pry their point from their hands? What about astroturfing makes reddit, a platform where you can build your own walled garden, a platform where you cannot find content that isn't filtered through US hegemony?
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nemothekid on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @09:26PM (#40152201)
Since the "alt-right pipeline" days and subsequent adpocalypse, YouTube has become an incredibly milquetoast platform. Twitter is no different than Meta when it comes to moderation, however instead of being "liberal american media", its just "conservative american media". While Meta censors you for being too far right, Twitter censors you for being too far left.

That said, my point isn't that "I can't watch pro-palestine content". TikTok presents the first major news platform used by Americans that wasn't created for Americans. For all the whining about how $social_media_platform doesn't offer diverse view points, that goes out the window when the owner isn't American.

I don't believe that China is better than America. I personally don't think it's a good thing that the US can just decide ban any content platform that isn't controlled by a US interest. I don't think it's good for the country and I think the security issues are overblown - any realistic security issue you can have with foreign interference, Meta has already committed and any legislation that does not address this just means the legislation doesn't really give a shit about security.

I don't think any Chinese viewpoint is inherently good, but the fact that millions of Americans cannot view content from a diversity of platforms is a problem.

Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by zeroonetwothree on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @05:41PM (#40150061)
Not the most unbiased source, let’s be honest
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nebula8804 on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @04:23PM (#40149113)
It allows you to see content typically hidden on other platforms. There should be freedom of choice. Its not like TikTok is the only game in town so if you are that triggered by the content that is on there then you should just log onto Meta platforms and leave the settings to restrict certain political posts that they quietly pushed to the "ON" setting.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by hhjinks on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @04:34PM (#40149254)
I asked you to substantiate it, not repeat exactly the same point again.
Re:Biden signs TikTok 'ban' bill into law, starting clock fo... by nebula8804 on Wednesday April 24, 2024 @04:44PM (#40149366)
There is so much content supporting this thesis with a 5 second google search.

[1]:https://www.hrw.org/report/2023/12/21/metas-broken-promises/...

As I have mentioned above and in other replies. Meta platforms has quietly introduced a filter for certain political topics that was pushed to their user base with no notification.

[2]:https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/meta-limit-some-fa...