Re:If programming languages were religions
by russell on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @02:17PM
(#399869)
He left out assembly languages which are really unrelated tribal religions characterized by primitive belief systems and rites of passage such as killing a lion, hanging by your thumbs, full body tattoos, or living alone in a cave for a month. I know. I passed my trial. I am a real man.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by shaunxcode on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @01:13PM
(#399773)
I feel the omission of smalltalk is just further evidence of it's true strength considering it inspired so many of the attributes of the other religions yet still persists unknown to the masses as the true religion with no religion behind all religion.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by byrneseyeview on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @03:32PM
(#400001)
As soon as I saw the title, I knew Lisp would be Zen. I don't think that takes any thought -- regardless of their actual qualities, they have the same mystique.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by rsheridan6 on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @04:24PM
(#400091)
I had a slightly different take on it: Scheme as Zen, and CL as Tibetan Buddhism, which has added deities and other more complicated theology back into Buddhism, sort of like the complexity of CL.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by juliend2 on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @12:54PM
(#399736)
Some people tend to see it as a meme. It's not THAT far from a religion. Except, i didn't see any C++ programmer kill in the name of Bjarne Stroustrup...Yet.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by Retric on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @01:27PM
(#399795)
Yep, ASM is the one true path that directly interfaces you with the underlying messy reality, but is only truly understood by a few arcane practitioners.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by eru on Thursday December 18, 2008 @07:06PM
(#402799)
There's a group that practises a stronger version of Agnosticism. They say "We don't know, and it does not matter. (But it matters that it does not matter.)"
Re:If programming languages were religions
by IsaacSchlueter on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @06:07PM
(#400247)
Javascript would be some kind of new-agey pop religion.
It looks at first like Christianity or Judaism, but it somehow brings in funky zen concepts like lambdas and prototype chains. No one really took it seriously, then one day, it was just everywhere. No two implementations are quite the same, and most people do it horribly.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by herval on Saturday December 20, 2008 @04:40PM
(#404838)
does anyone really do javascript fulltime...? It sounds to me like doing CSS fulltime. Or writing XML configuration files for a living. Or something...
Re:If programming languages were religions
by rsheridan6 on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @05:40PM
(#400203)
You'd think from the name that it's like Java, which is analogous to Judaism, but it really has nothing to do with Java. Maybe Madonna-style pop Kabala?
Re:If programming languages were religions
by szopa on Wednesday December 17, 2008 @03:14PM
(#401383)
Hm, JavaScript is in fact a nice little Scheme with a cute little object system originating from Self with an ugly, ugly, ugly C-like/Javaish syntax and some dark, horrible secrets (like an asymmetric, atransitive `=='). Moreover, a lot of people use it, but not so many understand it...
Re:If programming languages were religions
by russell on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @01:51PM
(#399833)
Commandment 8 reminds me of the Brace Wars in C and the Indent 4 vs Indent 8 camps. Those who dislike Python's significant white space haven't seen real bloodshed.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by icey on Thursday December 18, 2008 @08:39AM
(#402102)
Well, when I hear that something is a mix of a bunch of other things, I tend to picture the best about those things.
So if Ruby had:
* The clarity of Python
* As well as the batteries-includedness of Python
* With the flexibility of Perl
* As well as a library managed as well as CPAN
* With the tooling of Smalltalk
* But without the weird VM business
Then Ruby would be much more attractive to me. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with Ruby, it's a fine language. I'm just saying that I hear those three things and I picture some sort of uber-language.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by jpd on Thursday December 18, 2008 @03:01PM
(#402565)
I find python's clarity lacking in comparison to ruby, at least in terms of making classes and iterators. Why are all those underscores really necessary?
No mention on your other points here because I either agree or don't have an experienced opinion on the matter.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by shaunxcode on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @02:33PM
(#399897)
Also does this make the jvm and or parrot like one of those weird new-age "all paths lead to the sun" sort of religions where "anything goes"/syntax so long as it involves some rough idea of a god/bytecode?
Re:If programming languages were religions
by mynameishere on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @02:48PM
(#399922)
Dumb article. Judaism and C are about as opposite as you can get. Judaism's texts (the bible and the Talmud) are famously convoluted, contradictory, debated, etc. C is one of the cleanest languages.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by Retric on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @03:27PM
(#399994)
"Judaism's texts (the bible and the Talmud) are famously convoluted, contradictory, debated, etc." that sounds like C's type system to me. Is that a char or a number? A pointer or a number? etc.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by jrockway on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @02:57PM
(#399933)
Yeah, Perl sucks. Instead of making me rewrite libraries, I have to actually work on the problem I want to solve, 'cause the libraries already work. I hate being productive!!1!
Re:If programming languages were religions
by run4yourlives on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @07:23PM
(#400329)
Using the words PERL and productive without a not qualifier in the same sentence opens up some sort of alternate universe time warp that is so dangerous it should be avoided at all costs.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by SwellJoe on Thursday December 18, 2008 @01:19AM
(#401871)
Irony...like rain on your wedding day? Or maybe a traffic jam when you're already late?
I'm not sure you and I are working with the same definition of irony here. You don't like Perl, that we understand. But if you can honestly say you believe that Perl is not among the most productive, if not the most productive, glue languages for use in UNIX system administration tasks...then, well, I don't know what to say. One can't really have a rational discussion with someone who is that far off the map.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by jbjohns on Sunday December 21, 2008 @04:41PM
(#405745)
He was actually pretty nice to perl (even went as far as to say you will have to use it). What exactly would he have had to say for you not to be offended? Say it's as readable as Python? It isn't.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by dhimes on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @07:54PM
(#400362)
I've read many analyses of languages: their pros and cons, how much better I would think if I used them, how much more efficient I would be if I used them, how much cooler I would be if I used them.
But nothing was enough to convince to change. Until this. Fundamentalist Christianity. Well, goddamn.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by retyred on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @03:18PM
(#399967)
his comments on C are completely unfounded. C's type coercion means you can ram all sorts of things into places they aren't supposed to go. typecasting says to me that there is nothing orthodox about C at all. if anything it is modern protestantism, a faith that lets you ram in whatever you want, but one wrong move and you go to hell (segfault)
Re:If programming languages were religions
by GrandMasterBirt on Wednesday December 17, 2008 @12:48AM
(#400607)
I don't understand how anyone can be against us Pastafarians/Lolcoders!!! What is wrong with everyone? Just because I write legibly does not mean that I don't want my code to tell me that its in my pants waiting for input!
And obviously you all have not been blessed by his noodly appendages, but I shall not go and spread our sacred gospel, he shall come and touch you with his noodliness and you shall instantly convert.
Re:If programming languages were religions
by gruseom on Tuesday December 16, 2008 @03:44PM
(#400022)
As the original poster stated, please don't kill me if you are offended. Its aim was humor.
Bit of a tangent, but I never understand why people say this. Don't they know that humor is one of the most potent weapons? If someone is offended, will they be less offended that they are regarded as laughable?
(Tangent to the tangent - this reminds me a little of Jon Stewart hiding behind "But I'm only a comedian" every time someone wants to talk about the politics in his satire. I happen to like his satire a lot and have no particular objection to his politics, but this is just disingenuous.)
I feel strangely peaceful.
And a little perverse.
* Syntax is an illusion, created by our own subjective definitions of words.
* All suffering (stack management trouble) is caused by the desire for and attachment to the worldly concept of variables.
"I have never written more than 10 lines of code in any language."
Concise is clear and short, terse is less characters but unreadable.
That makes me think of the jews who live in Saudi Arabia and know enough of the Coran to pass as muslims.
Java would be islam then. No wonder it sounds indonesian.
Aka it's Quantum Mechanics ;)
http://www.boingboing.net/2008/12/15/today-on-offworld-13.ht...
Dim! Yuck.
It looks at first like Christianity or Judaism, but it somehow brings in funky zen concepts like lambdas and prototype chains. No one really took it seriously, then one day, it was just everywhere. No two implementations are quite the same, and most people do it horribly.
1. Everyone knows it a little, but few actually use it for much, and hardly anyone really understands it.
2. A lot of the ideas came out of old tribal warfare, and was only standardized relatively recently.
3. People who do it full time are WAY overpaid. ;)
My guess is that JavaScript is Zensunni: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zensunni#Zensunni.
Is that really true? I've never heard anything like that about Ruby. It does, however, sound very much like PHP. From the PHP FAQs:
"Much of [PHP's] syntax is borrowed from C, Java and Perl with a couple of unique PHP-specific features thrown in."
So if Ruby had:
Then Ruby would be much more attractive to me. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with Ruby, it's a fine language. I'm just saying that I hear those three things and I picture some sort of uber-language.No mention on your other points here because I either agree or don't have an experienced opinion on the matter.
http://jes.com/gfx/people/csn_1983_11_28_antigrav_dick_001.j...
(Sure don't mean to offend anyone, just a silly hacker joke.)
Sheesh!
I'm not sure you and I are working with the same definition of irony here. You don't like Perl, that we understand. But if you can honestly say you believe that Perl is not among the most productive, if not the most productive, glue languages for use in UNIX system administration tasks...then, well, I don't know what to say. One can't really have a rational discussion with someone who is that far off the map.
But nothing was enough to convince to change. Until this. Fundamentalist Christianity. Well, goddamn.
How can I distribute desktop apps in Lisp? :)
I do not get it. Haskell is very similar to other languages, take Clean for example.
ask Dante Alighieri...
And obviously you all have not been blessed by his noodly appendages, but I shall not go and spread our sacred gospel, he shall come and touch you with his noodliness and you shall instantly convert.
And here I would consider PHP the defintion of going to hell :)
Bit of a tangent, but I never understand why people say this. Don't they know that humor is one of the most potent weapons? If someone is offended, will they be less offended that they are regarded as laughable?
(Tangent to the tangent - this reminds me a little of Jon Stewart hiding behind "But I'm only a comedian" every time someone wants to talk about the politics in his satire. I happen to like his satire a lot and have no particular objection to his politics, but this is just disingenuous.)