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Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by garba_dlm on Friday October 13, 2023 @12:50AM (#37866815)
so essentially: "because you only have worse choices"
Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by marcyb5st on Friday October 13, 2023 @12:55AM (#37866855)
Except that in one I can say "my president is an idiot. We need a leadership change" without wiping my credit score or being detained.
Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by keepamovin on Friday October 13, 2023 @01:37AM (#37867079)
True. But it's important to note that it is likely that, given the requirements of creating large, functioning systems of administration, it might be true that all governing systems are trying to solve the same types of problems.

And it's worth remembering that, even in the US there exist examples of people who pushed for real change to these systems, and ended up detained, dead or simply disappeared.

It might also be worthwhile to consider the following well known allegations: revolving door appointments between bureaucracy and companies that it interfaces with and regulates; compromise of politicians by various interest groups using bribery of blackmail; the effects of corporate lobbying and donations to distort the legislative and electoral processes; the powers of unelected career bureaucrats whose tenures often outlast elected officials.

It's important to recall that the US is not alone is allegedly suffering from these maladies, but that it might suffer from them ought be a cause for concern.

Such considerations seem to raise the question of whether the president (and associated democratic and elected apparatuses) are in some way figureheads designed to provide a focus and an outlet, but may also function to protect the overall system against substantial reforms.

Such a description may help explain why processes in democracies often stagnate.

The is not to say that the Chinese system is "better" in any sense (our first consideration indicates that perhaps all large governing systems must essentially be the same), but it might be more honest about what it is.

This gives rise to the sense that democracy, at least in part, may be a deception that usefully provides people the illusion of a voice for change, while at the same time protecting the governing system by ensuring people do not seek more disruptive methods to alter it.

Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by Roark66 on Friday October 13, 2023 @01:56AM (#37867218)
>This gives rise to the sense that democracy, at least in part, may be a deception that usefully provides people the illusion of a voice for change, while at the same time protecting the governing system by ensuring people do not seek more disruptive methods to alter it.

As Churchill said, "democracy is the worst form of government, except all others". Are there elements in democracies that entrench the status quo? Of course, especially in countries like the UK and the US with single member district, first past the post systems that favor huge parties that never change. Here we have a pretty complex party list based system that is often critiqued as "too difficult to understand for the average voter", but when people want to change who rules the country they have more than 1 viable choice of opposition. You may say, nah, it is not about the system of voting, duopoly is a feature of "mature" democracies that have been around for 400 years. To which I'll give an example of Poland where the lower chamber of parliament (Sejm) is voted for party lists proportionally and it always has a mix of many parties, and the upper chamber (Senat) that uses the classic "first past the post" system and in the senate 2 major parties(the biggest party and the current biggest opposition party) always get 95%+ of the seats.

Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by keepamovin on Friday October 13, 2023 @03:08AM (#37867670)
I'm not an electoral mechanics geek but I appreciate the details, even if much of it flies over my head. Do you perchance have any resources where I could better understand such things?

Also, I think your points are very interesting but may benefit from some paragraphing for added clarity and coherence.

Another point of note is that, while interesting, it may be the case that no matter how much a government optimizes its electoral systems, it may still be subject to the other vulnerabilities listed above, which sadly might subsume any gains from such optimization.

Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by cscurmudgeon on Friday October 13, 2023 @01:12AM (#37866957)
Ha, you can say that in China too (about the US president lol).
Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by kube-system on Friday October 13, 2023 @02:30AM (#37867423)
Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by lsofzz on Friday October 13, 2023 @06:18AM (#37868952)
United States of China.

Peoples Republic of United States.

Sounds the same.

Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by friendzis on Friday October 13, 2023 @02:34AM (#37867444)
Half seriously, what's the difference between your career ruined via social credit being wiped by government or your career ruined via social credit being wiped on Twitter?
Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by pgeorgi on Friday October 13, 2023 @03:00AM (#37867604)
It's pretty simple to not be on Twitter. It's comparably hard to evade governments.
Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by Detrytus on Friday October 13, 2023 @04:18AM (#37868146)
Just because you are not on Twitter (or Facebook, or whatever) won't stop other people from tweeting lies about you. And the public image that you have on social media matters a lot in this society. See also: "Cancel culture".
Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by mschuster91 on Friday October 13, 2023 @04:18AM (#37868143)
> or your career ruined via social credit being wiped on Twitter?

Whose career got ruined actually? Johnny Depp is still making movies, Rammstein just announced a 2024 tour, JKR still is making millions upon millions every year with Harry Potter, Trump is likely to be the Republican candidate in 2024. "Cancel culture" isn't real.

Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by xcdzvyn on Friday October 13, 2023 @07:04AM (#37869230)
One's a repressive government and one's some number of people choosing not to like you very much anymore?
Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by garba_dlm on Friday October 13, 2023 @10:04AM (#37870764)
"due process"???

but we've gotta update this now that the law will turn to software

Re:Mathematician warns US spies may be weakening next-gen en... by mardifoufs on Friday October 13, 2023 @10:33PM (#37877640)
So I guess the op was right, why does the rest of the world use American standards, since we can't choose your president either

(I don't actually believe that we shouldn't use NIST standards, but my point is that's a pretty weak argument for non Americans. )