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Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by layer8 on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @08:56AM (#37673940)
I don’t know, I hate the idea of having to hold a natural-language conversation with a computer in order to make use of its functionality.

It feels like being one of those Futurama heads in a jar that can’t do anything by themselves.

Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by morkalork on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @09:35AM (#37674450)
UIs being dumbed down for average users was already annoying. Apparently the process won't stop until the illiterate are included too.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by sureglymop on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @11:48AM (#37676452)
But what is bad about that? Why shouldn't they be included?
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by CamperBob2 on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @03:18PM (#37679826)
It's a race to the bottom.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by at_a_remove on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @08:29PM (#37683560)
This agrees with my experience. When I have begun to automate complex manual systems (nibbling from each end, typically), I note when I watch people use the finished product (at each step) that they simply find some other facet of the job to pay less attention to. The eventual error rate just returns to what it was before.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by edgyquant on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @01:11PM (#37677803)
Ideally it won’t stop until computers are something we rarely think about. For me I love the CLI but having to use a mouse is a drag and causes serious wrist pain at this point in my life. Typing on a keyboard and clicking with a mouse are not the end all, be all of interacting with information systems.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by yamazakiwi on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @03:51PM (#37680293)
The illiterate are customers, of course they will be included.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by TOMDM on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @10:02AM (#37674798)
There's nothing stopping developers from taking a prompt to GPT and sticking it behind a button or command line, with options in the UI interpolated into the prompt.

For now almost all applications of ChatGPT happen in chat windows because it requires no further integration, but there's no reason to expect things will always be this way.

Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by boplicity on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @10:18AM (#37675031)
Visual input is not "natural language." The implications of that could, especially in the long-term, could be incredibly far-reaching, and possibly even terrifying.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by IKantRead on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @10:31AM (#37675203)
> I hate the idea of having to hold a natural-language conversation with a computer in order to make use of its functionality.

I hate the idea of having to use a mouse to click on a visual GUI to navigate a file system in order to make use of its functionality.

It's less the case today, even among developers, but it wasn't that long ago that I remember that any serious technical user of a computer took it as a point of pride to touch the mouse as little as possible. They're also still correct in that thinking. The command line is a very powerful UI with lots of benefits and while the mouse makes navigating the OS easier it's still much more limited than command line usage.

Touch screen interfaces are another example of an easier UI that ultimately feels even more limited. But people still plug their iPad pros in to magic keyboard folios frequently.

Having worked with these tools everyday for awhile now the "AI will change UX" is such a better take than "AI will conquer the world!". AI does fundamentally open up new work flows and user experiences, many of which do over a lot of potential improvements over their predecessors.

At the same time I doubt we'll see a world where we don't end up using the command line for the majority of serious technical work.

Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by troupo on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @03:37PM (#37680106)
> Touch screen interfaces are another example of an easier UI that ultimately feels even more limited.

Depends o the use case. Touch screen is much more powerful than command line for maps, for example. Or for drawing. Mouse + keyboard is much more powerful than just keyboard for DAWs. And so on and so on.

Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by jiggawatts on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @05:22PM (#37681499)
> I hate the idea of having to use a mouse to click on a visual GUI to navigate a file system in order to make use of its functionality.

Ironically, studies have shown that mouse-based interfaces are more efficient for practically all filesystem use-cases compared to CLI interfaces.

Despite objectively faster-time-to-solution, people self-report that they "feel" that the mouse GUIs are slower.

That's because there's fewer actions per second when using a mouse. It's a smooth gliding motion and then a single click, versus many keystrokes in a row with a CLI.

Rapid actions feel faster, even if it takes more wall-clock time to achieve a task.

Keep this in mind next time you sneer at a "bad graphic user interface" for being "slow".

Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by not2b on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @08:55PM (#37683782)
Pratically all? I regularly need to select a subset of a very large number of files to do something with. Example: I have a directory, or possibly a tree, with thousands of photos. The photos have the date in ISO 9000 format embedded in their name. Your job is to find all the files from February 2021 and copy them to specified location, and there are 50 of them. Good luck using a visual GUI for that, unless it has the exact selection mechanism you need. Sure, mouse clicking is easier if you're selecting one file from a small set of files to open in a particular program. But I usually find myself frustrated when the only tool I have is a GUI.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by Jakob on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @09:49PM (#37684197)
Personally, I would use the terminal, too for a throwaway use case like this. But GUIs are very good at that and faster when you do more than the naïve case, they also allow to see intermediate steps.

For your use case, on macOS open Automator.app and add three actions

  1. "ask for finder items" (the source folder)
  2. "filter finder items" (by name)
  3. "copy finder items" (to target folder)
This takes roughly 5 clicks, 10 seconds at most.

Repeatability and configurability is where the GUI action shines. With only one click more you can

- add filtering by size, opening date, modification date, etc. in addition or a combination thereof

- do the same action for multiple source folders and the same target folder

- choose whether you want to replace existing files

- add it as a folder action that runs automatically on modification of the source folder

Arguably much slower on the terminal.

Alternative on macOS, that works on all other major OS with similar shortcuts and a similar feature set, just not repeatable:

  1. Go to source folder (shift-cmd-G)
  2. Filter (cmd-shift-F)
  3. Copy (cmd-A, cmd-C)
  4. Go to target folder (shift-cmd-G)
  5. Paste (cmd-V)
This repeatability, configurability and automation is where GPT falls short, for now.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by JHonaker on Thursday September 28, 2023 @12:57PM (#37692414)
I believe you, and I'm coming to this conclusion myself, after being a keyboard warrior for years.

Do you have any sources I can read though? I always find it fascinating when our perceptions are so off like this.

Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by thelastparadise on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @07:39PM (#37683073)
Right on, brother!

Plus I think there's a nuance to what you're saying:

UX is not just about making the best channel surfing interface, which is essentially what phones/tablets are. We need UIs that are capable of rich interaction and expression of ideas, creation, etc.

Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by mnky9800n on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @03:04PM (#37679613)
Come on, you don't want an anxious, golden robot that mostly just causes drama but also happens to be fluent in over 6 million forms of communication so it can translate for you whenever you go on holiday?
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by DelightOne on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @03:13PM (#37679750)
I wouldn't mind an UI fully configurable by AI to fit me exactly. Without having to learn obscure settings, some obscure declarative language or how the UI is implemented.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by Nfthero on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @03:27PM (#37679962)
I got Tendonitis and very very curious how soon I can really start to do an interaction like in star trek.

Walking around and thinking out loud with the computer.

Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by sexy_seedbox on Wednesday September 27, 2023 @09:15PM (#37683936)
Pretty sure somebody has made a Starfleet Badge before tied to Alexa or Google Home, just need to change it to ChatGPT and mentioning "computer" activates it.
Re:First Impressions with GPT-4V(ision) by jug on Thursday September 28, 2023 @03:21AM (#37686415)
And for less perfect designs you’ll have ChatGPT rolling out voice chat on smartphones pretty much now to Plus subscribers.

And as for third party solutions, you have watchGPT for Apple Watch with voice commands and support for adding it as a watch complication.