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Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by unethical_ban on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @12:07PM (#37585944)
Nothing like a troll-named account to post a lot of brash talk without the courage to name where they're from.

How silly to try to talk about a handful of climate protestors who actually give a shit about the planet in the same breath you talk about garbage exports (citing... Nothing) and then using that to excuse China and India using rivers as their own garbage disposal.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by fakedang on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @12:19PM (#37586108)
I'm Indian, been living in Europe and Switzerland for almost the past decade. I've spent a considerable time of my upbringing in South east Asia and the Middle East. I currently reside in Switzerland, specifically Zurich, with occasional stints to the US for business. I used to live in Germany prior to that. There used to be a time I dreamt of Western citizenship, but not anymore. Hope that answers your "question", although I'm certain you'd be loathe to reciprocate the same favor to me and reveal your origin.

As for the climate hypocrisy argument, sorry to hurt your preconceived notions, but it's already proven that most of the waste that ends up dumped in Malaysia, Indonesia and the Philippines.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-malaysia-environment-plas...

https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Environment/Philippines-sl....

https://e360.yale.edu/features/plastic-waste-imports-recycli...

But go on, vacillate and down vote in your self righteousness.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by unethical_ban on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @12:52PM (#37586585)
I applaud you for answering the question. I'm from Texas, United States.

Your argument comparing climate protestors and governments who ship garbage to developing countries is bunk, though. Ever thought about who those protestors are angry with?

An intelligent conversation can be had about failing democratic institutions in the west, the need to disincentive wasteful consumption, and (as happens already) what levels of support developed countries owe to developing countries to dissuade the latter from ramping up fossil fuels consumption.

But your finger wagging still doesn't make sense in the context of thinking India or the developing world is any better.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by fakedang on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @11:06PM (#37592786)
> But your finger wagging still doesn't make sense in the context of thinking India or the developing world is any better.

I never implied that India or China are doing any better (although India has taken massive strides which is usually ignored by the West). My gripe is with Western countries criticizing the global south for environmental neglect, when they don't do anything about it and simply ship away their problems.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/30/climate/oil-kenya-africa-...

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by glogla on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @01:33PM (#37587101)
Ah, a migrant who hates those who took him in. What a common thing. Why are you still around?

Stop being a parasite and return to India if you hate Europe that much. But no, no, you people seem to hate the places you run off to but don't want to return. Same with Russians enjoying the "decadent gay West" while claiming they hate it and supporting Putin. Same with Turks living on German welfare while loving Erdogan.

Put your money where your mouth is and go back to India. Then you can complain.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by avgcorrection on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @02:14PM (#37587745)
Our Western attitude towards freedom of opinion on display.
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by glogla on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @02:56PM (#37588423)
Why do people always assume that freedom of expression only applies to one side?

He is free to hate the West while living in it. He's not going to prison for it (unlike he would in the countries he likes, ironically). He's not getting deported from the West despite claiming to hate the West or anything.

But I am also free to call him out on it. I have the same freedom, no? Why would he have the freedom to insult me (and you, since you said "our western") but not us to insult him back?

He can call me a hypocrite for West not being perfect and not solving all the problems of the world, and I can call him hypocrite for hating the West and its values yet still living in here for want of luxury. Is it a useful conversation? Not really, honestly, but it is fair.

But more importantly, look up paradox of tolerance and philosophy following from it. You can tolerate a lot, but tolerating too much is suicidal, because the intolerant will eventually take over. This is a general principle - welcoming people in the West is fine, for example, welcoming people who hate the West and want to destroy it is not.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by avgcorrection on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @03:07PM (#37588612)
Complete non-sequitur since I said nothing about restricting anyone's freedom to say anything. I was critiquing your attitude. Attitude.
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by glogla on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @05:23PM (#37590379)
I'm not convinced I owe nice attitude to someone who hates me and wants to destroy me and my way of life.
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by avgcorrection on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @05:37PM (#37590564)
I mean go nuts with that for all I care. But the refrain “then just leave” is the most unoriginal and vapid comeback. If someone has a bad opinion or argument then it shouldn't be hard to come up with something better.

Absolutely anyone under any regime—British or Iranian—can say “then leave if you don't like it”.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by fakedang on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @10:57PM (#37592731)
This is just pulling a strawman argument. I'm criticizing the West for precisely destroying the way of life that you have had, in favour of some misguided sense of tolerance intermixed with arrogance. I don't need to destroy you or your way of life, because a.) I don't think about you at all and b.) you and your government are already destroying your way of life.
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by unethical_ban on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @05:30PM (#37590479)
One can respect the freedom for someone to have an opinion and simultaneously criticize that opinion and its hypocrisy.
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by fakedang on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @09:00PM (#37592029)
Well he didn't criticize my points or barely even read it, since my monologue was on hypocritical Western European attitudes (after all, I implored GP to "talk to his fellow countrymen in the rural parts, outside the city shells".

Instead, his retort was to tell me to pack my bags and eff off.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by fakedang on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @08:56PM (#37592003)
"Go back to India." "Go back to Eastern Europe." "Go to Africa." Ahh yes, the same nationalistic tendencies that people in power put on display whenever they're in the majority.

"Stop being a parasite." Sure, I will. This is exactly the kind of attitude displayed by hoity-toity Europeans that has led me to this position. Curse on all the immigrants who actually struggled to create a life for themselves, which includes me and a number of my employees who also migrated (mostly from Eastern and Balkan Europe) in search of a better life in the West, by virtue of their talents and skills, while you import the best "doctors and engineers" from across the Med. You can tell my one of my Croatian employees to "stop being a parasite", even though he can't get a house to rent in his preferred locality by virtue of being from a Balkan country, in spite of earning 4x the median wage of the country. Yes, we're the parasites and cockroaches, and like any of those, we'll find a more inviting home (incidentally the US and Singapore are already being touted as options).

But you go on, you poor thing, and keep insulting us from your high and mighty "Europeanness". After all, it's only a few decades now till the end of twilight.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by glogla on Thursday September 21, 2023 @05:21PM (#37604549)
Stop pretending you struggled when you're an IT guy. There are people who actually struggled, people who don't live in luxury in the richest parts of Europe like you do and yet they are happy to be part of the struggle for better world that EU is trying and don't hate everyone like you do.
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by dang on Friday September 22, 2023 @12:15AM (#37607791)
You broke the site guidelines egregiously in this thread. We ban accounts that do that, and we've had to warn you about this several times before.

If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules when posting here, we'd appreciate it.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by dang on Friday September 22, 2023 @12:13AM (#37607780)
We've banned this account for breaking the site guidelines and ignoring our requests to stop.

If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email [email protected] and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. They're here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by freeopinion on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @01:04PM (#37586717)
I'm from the USA. Your post alarms me. You berate China and India for using rivers as their own garbage disposal. This seems to be a response to criticize somebody who is making the same claim, more or less.

I am not the original commenter, but let me add here my own observation. In the USA we have a lot of laws and regulations that are supposed to prevent industry from polluting the environment, exploiting child labor, unduly endangering their workforce, etc. You cannot produce a product to place on the shelves of Walmart if you violate these rules. I think most Americans support most of those regulations. But we do not impose those rules on companies from China or India.

This means that a product produced in the USA can cost significantly more than an identical product produced in India. Naturally, USA industry recognizes this and shifts their production out of the USA. You could characterize this as "ship your garbage to other poorer countries." That is, don't allow USA rivers to be polluted but make your money by polluting rivers outside the USA.

I don't suggest that the USA removes its prohibitions from USA industry. I suggest that they impose the same prohibitions on non-USA industry with respect to markets inside the USA. And by this I don't mean raise tariffs. I mean that if a company in Iowa is not allowed to put a product on the shelves at Walmart because their smokestack is too dirty, then a company in Qinghai should not be allowed to do so if their smokestack is too dirty by the same standard.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by glogla on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @01:24PM (#37586980)
Just downvote, flag and move on. This guy is here to insult people for fun and stir shit. No reason to engage (and yes, I know I'm also guilty of engaging with anti-Western but definitely not pro-Chinese/pro-Russian trolls).
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by avgcorrection on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @02:12PM (#37587714)
> Nothing like a troll-named account to post a lot of brash talk without the courage to name where they're from.

Oh my goodness, “brash talk”. We Westerners give out a whole laundry list of things that we do contary to our “proclaimed values” and then in the next paragraph say “anyway, if we don't get our act together the third-worlders might stop looking up to us and our values”.[1] It's farcical how arrogant that is.

[1] Mock quote.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by hef19898 on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @02:27PM (#37587923)
If you quote me, do it correctly. I mever said looking up, I said soft power in geo politics, which I think democracies should have. There is nothing saviour-related to this opinion.

Anyway, there is nothing good that came from the last NATO led interventions, did it? Which is part of the problem.

Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by avgcorrection on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @03:05PM (#37588567)
That part says “mock quote”. From the start.
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by hef19898 on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @03:23PM (#37588792)
So intentionally misreading comments? I think there is something in the HN guidelines about that...
Re:British journalist held by police at Luton airport for fi... by avgcorrection on Wednesday September 20, 2023 @03:32PM (#37588921)
No. (1) Talking generally and (2) reading into whatever the hell “soft power” means in this context.

But report me if you want. I'm sure all of us on this site would get banned because we (“we” as in HN, lest you accuse me of misreading again) constantly disagree about how we interpret each other here.