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Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by rolph on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:25PM (#36924194)
these numbers[data] came from the article :

[In 2019, 88% of the time L.A. County sheriff’s officers spent on stops was for officer-initiated stops rather than in response to calls. The overwhelming majority of that time – 79% – was spent on traffic violations. By contrast, just 11% of those hours was spent on stops based on reasonable suspicion of a crime.

In Riverside, about 83% of deputies’ time spent on officer-initiated stops went toward traffic violations, and just 7% on stops based on reasonable suspicion.

Moreover, most of the stops are pointless, other than inconveniencing citizens, or worse – “a routine practice of pretextual stops,” researchers wrote. Roughly three out of every four hours that Sacramento sheriff’s officers spent investigating traffic violations were for stops that ended in warnings, or no action].

[0] The report was published Oct. 25 by advocacy group Catalyst California and the ACLU of Southern California. It relies on county budgets' numbers and new policing data provided under the state’s Racial and Identity Profiling Act, which took effect in 2019.

[1] Report https://catalyst-ca.cdn.prismic.io/catalyst-ca/126c30a8-852c...

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by throwaway33381 on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:40PM (#36924322)
I feel as though this isn't that surprising when you realize that for most municipalities police forces are revenue generators. Meaning that their main job is in increasing the funding of the precincts they belong to by issuing tickets to traffic violators. You could go a step forward and say they are systemically incentivized to target specific groups due to them being perceived as outsiders but I think a lot of police precincts still enforce broken window theory.
Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by wahnfrieden on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:44PM (#36924368)
Pretext stops don’t generate ticketing revenue. They’re used in the hopes of finding more serious (by law anyway) crimes once they’re able to get a closer look.
Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by ceejayoz on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:56PM (#36924480)
> Pretext stops don’t generate ticketing revenue.

Sure they do. They’re still getting the broken taillight fine after the cop searches the car.

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by wahnfrieden on Saturday July 29, 2023 @05:02PM (#36924550)
3/4 end with warnings or no action. They’re not pursuing dangerous drivers or fines, they’re pursuing targets they think they can escalate to more serious charges (such as weed possession, in other states anyway)
Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by tremon on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:43PM (#36924357)
most of the stops are pointless, other than inconveniencing citizens [..] that ended in warnings

Such actions are most emphatically NOT pointless, they are preventative: informing someone that their bad behaviour is noticed is often enough to keep well-meaning citizens on the right side of the law. What's your proposed alternative? That every interaction with the police must result in a fine?

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by mschuster91 on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:54PM (#36924457)
> Such actions are most emphatically NOT pointless, they are preventative: informing someone that their bad behaviour is noticed is often enough to keep well-meaning citizens on the right side of the law.

The problem is selective enforcement. And let's face the truth: most laws are enforced only against minorities, or as someone else put it shortly:

> Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.

Hell, just look at the marijuana prohibition, it was explicitly done to be able to criminalize lefties and Black persons [1].

[1] https://edition.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-...

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by deepfriedchokes on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:51PM (#36924423)
Isn’t that really just harassment and intimidation?
Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by rocqua on Saturday July 29, 2023 @05:19PM (#36924748)
"Hey, your tail light is out. Won't give you a ticket this time, but please do get it fixed". Is neither harassement nor intimidation. But it does remind people that these things are noticed, and that failing to fix a taillight might actually earn you a fine.
Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by kentt on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:56PM (#36924481)
Totally depends. It's easy to imagine a situation where responding to a noise complaint would ideally finish with a warning.
Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by llbeansandrice on Saturday July 29, 2023 @05:02PM (#36924541)
The data is specifically referring to officer initiated traffic stops. Noise complaints are often reported by neighbors and then responded to.

So cops are just stopping drivers and giving them warnings. It sounds like harassment to me.

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by rolph on Saturday July 29, 2023 @05:01PM (#36924532)
in the case of a stop that quickly becomes a terry stop.

in the case of i stopped you because -rear lights, i see noone else has a notation on your marker, go get it repaired, right now...then your free to go,

thats how i generally see a traffic stop actually being a traffic stop.

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by bluepizza on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:47PM (#36924396)
Aren't accidents something like the third largest cause of death in the US?

Sounds quite logical to me that they'd spend the largest amount of time and resources on that.

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by wahnfrieden on Saturday July 29, 2023 @04:53PM (#36924451)
These are pretext stops. They target people they aim to escalate charges with, not dangerous drivers. That’s why they end with minor warnings.
Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by the_lego on Saturday July 29, 2023 @05:04PM (#36924567)
How does the data distinguish between a pretext stop, and a stop for a genuine traffic infraction, like minor speeding or a broken light, that a cop uses their discretion on and issues only a warning?

Naively, forcing cops to apply the law even more strictly and always issue fines for minor violations, is not something we want, is it?

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by ldoughty on Saturday July 29, 2023 @05:10PM (#36924649)
The comments you're making (and that source material itself) makes it sound like the traffic stops are like.... profiling people and wasting their time...

The 79% on traffic stops is an officer acting on what they classified to be a traffic violation -- it's not 79% of them are pretextual stops & warnings, and 11% are catching speeders/reckless drivers... it's 79% pulling over speeders/reckless/etc. drivers and 11% "reasonable suspicion of a crime that is not traffic related"

If you think about it that way... People CONSANTLY violate traffic laws... So it's not terribly surprising. I certainly hope calls for help are promptly answered, but that source doesn't seem to include data other than the fact that responding to calls for help takes twice as long as a traffic stop for an officer's time.

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by rolph on Saturday July 29, 2023 @05:13PM (#36924677)
actually the entire block of text, is from the article, none are my comments, i posted this for convenience so people would have it righthere.

so please take this into account.

Re:Police are not primarily crime fighters, according to the... by rolph on Saturday July 29, 2023 @08:20PM (#36926319)
>>ldoughty I get it, its an honest mistake, in response to a muddy quotation style.

cheers