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Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @09:33PM (#35896141)
But you are cheating someone. The creators of the videos you're watching don't get anything when you block the ads. That means you've cheated them of money, on top of cheating the company of money.

It's not handed to you for free, there's an implicit condition that you watch the content and the ads that are served with it. Too many people don't do that and that's why YouTube is now testing blocking ad-blockers. You reap what you sow.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by krapp on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @09:44PM (#35896241)
>It's not handed to you for free, there's an implicit condition that you watch the content and the ads that are served with it.

No, there isn't. The web was designed from the beginning to allow the end user to have control over what content is and is not displayed. It isn't television, radio or magazines, the platform owner doesn't have complete control over the layout and display of the content they serve. There is no condition, implicit or otherwise, that the end user will pretend they're consuming an old media product just because web platforms can't move beyond old media models of revenue.

None of which require viewing, reading or listening to the ads, either. Ads have always been a gentleman's agreement.

>Too many people don't do that and that's why YouTube is now testing blocking ad-blockers. You reap what you sow.

No, Youtube is going to reap what it sowed, because no one is going to turn off their ad blockers. If their platform was worth paying for, everyone would have moved to the paid tier by now. Google bought a free video service and tried and failed to monetize it to the point of nearly ruining it for content creators with their puritanical rules, arbitrary demonitization, opaque to nonexistent support and restrictive algorithm, but no matter how much they squeeze the turnip, it won't bleed enough for them.

That's not our problem. We'll gladly support content creators directly through Patreon or other means, but Google can get fucked.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:08PM (#35896447)
Which brings us right back to the article: don't be surprised when your ad-blocker stops working.

Service high bitrate video is not cheap and YouTube is notoriously breaking even at best. Any alternative is going to be even less efficient and more expensive due to the lack of economies of scale that Google has. If that's what you want so long as it doesn't have Google's name in the corner, so be it, that's understandable.

>If their platform was worth paying for, everyone would have moved to the paid tier by now.

I disagree. I think people are inherently cheap and will exhaust other options of getting the same content for free first. We shall see I guess.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by krapp on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:00PM (#35896804)
> don't be surprised when your ad-blocker stops working

Yes, it's an arms race, always has been. But it's more expensive for them to break the ad blockers than it will be for the ad blockers to inevitably update, so if it's a war of attrition, they will still inevitably lose.

The problem isn't that people aren't watching the ads, the problem is Google's business model doesn't work, not for Google, not for the consumer and certainly not for content creators, and the only solution they can come up with is trying to force people to watch ads - which never works.

>Any alternative is going to be even less efficient and more expensive due to the lack of economies of scale that Google has.

I mean, plenty of alternatives already exist, and content creators are starting to lead viewers to those alternatives, because of Youtube's arbitrary censorship and demonetization. Every social media platform hosts video now. There are decentralized platforms like Peertube. We're way past the point where "streaming video" is a hard problem that only Google-scale infrastructure can solve.

They're going to have to innovate or die like any other company, and disabuse themselves of the illusion that the web is a gravy train where the rules of supply and demand don't apply. This isn't innovation, this is desperation.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:06PM (#35896853)
Which alternatives host and stream up to 4K@60 HDR videos for free/ads only?
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by krapp on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:46PM (#35897140)
I don't know, but given the choice of watching slightly lower quality videos (which probably look the same on their phones anyway) and paying for a free service, most people will prefer lower quality videos.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pulvinar on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @09:47PM (#35896281)
If I were to allow all ads but make it a rule to never actually watch them or heaven forbid, buy anything in them, would that be ok? I'm sure it would be ok with the content provider, because then they get their money and that's all that counts.

If I can't watch it without ads, I simply won't watch it. And I certainly won't pay for it if it still includes ads.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @09:58PM (#35896364)
>If I were to allow all ads but make it a rule to never actually watch them or heaven forbid, buy anything in them, would that be ok?

Yes, you would be holding up your end of the agreement.

>If I can't watch it without ads, I simply won't watch it. And I certainly won't pay for it if it still includes ads.

Buy YouTube Premium and you won't get any ads and the content creators you watch will get more money than if an ad had played instead. Win-win.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pulvinar on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:12PM (#35896479)
I don't remember ever seeing an agreement. I'm not a subscriber.

But it's interesting that you'd have no problem with me never buying anything in the ads. What's the purpose of them again?

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by naikrovek on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:46PM (#35896703)
the purpose of an advertisement is to give advertisement companies something to sell to product makers, and to give product makers something to have media companies put in front of viewers in exchange for money.

it's a whole economy unto itself. money changing hands, jobs, all of it. almost no one buys something because they saw an ad for it.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by judge2020 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:10PM (#35896882)
Your use of the service is governed by the terms[0], which say "You are not allowed to:... alter, modify or otherwise use any part of the Service or any Content...". Even if you've never signed up for a Google account, it's implicit that YouTube doesn't actually serve anything for free, every video view and page load is a transaction for "youtube serves me content and I pay for it by having screen real estate taken up by ads". They do not have to serve the content if they think you aren't upholding your end of the bargain, which is this ad blocker block.

0: https://www.youtube.com/t/terms#c3e2907ca8

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by freehorse on Thursday May 11, 2023 @02:34AM (#35898511)
I am sorry, but the internet right now is bloated with ads that slow down everything and create an absolute distraction when one tries to browse, I do not care if they have problem modifying the appearance and behaviour of a webpage that I have loaded on my browser, but this goes to anything in the internet basically. I am not gonna compromise myself before they all fix the internet of the mess they have created.

I pay for the content that I think it is worth supporting, and that's it. I do not think youtube is worth supporting, and if quite often the only reason I watch things there instead of somewhere else is due to laziness. Same for many creators I follow probably. If they set adblock restrictions I will just stop watching and that's it.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by brewdad on Thursday May 11, 2023 @12:04AM (#35897282)
What about all the YouTube videos where ads are part of the program? If YT Premium could block those too, I might subscribe.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by orthoxerox on Thursday May 11, 2023 @04:48AM (#35899512)
SponsorBlock to the rescue
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by kingrazor on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:08PM (#35896444)
This is the same argument people make about piracy. About potential revenue. The fact of the matter is, if I couldn't watch the video without either watching ads or paying for premium, I wouldn't watch it at all. So, the creator gets no money either way. Same thing when I pirate software or a movie or a game. I wouldn't have paid for it anyway, so the amount of money the creator gets is the same, zero.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:29PM (#35896593)
So don't watch it then. Serving video is not cheap and you're increasing costs for everyone else. I don't get to jump the fence at a music festival just because I wouldn't have gone if I had to pay.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by naikrovek on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:41PM (#35896669)
yep. there's a word for a creature that consumes without contributing anything back, making things harder for everyone else: "parasite."
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by kingrazor on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:54PM (#35896755)
Alphabet has plenty of money. So long as I'm capable of watching Youtube for free with adblock on, I will continue to do so and feel no guilt.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:59PM (#35896791)
I can't stop you but just know that you're part of the problem.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by brewdad on Thursday May 11, 2023 @12:02AM (#35897260)
I don’t see the problem here. YouTubers can make content or not. Either way they are not entitled to my money.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Thursday May 11, 2023 @12:09AM (#35897327)
You're not entitled to their content either but you force yourself to it anyway.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by kingrazor on Thursday May 11, 2023 @12:23AM (#35897445)
Sure we are. If you make your content available on a public platform, where it is both possible and legal to watch it for free, then we are entitled to it if we choose to utilize the tools that make it possible, until or unless it becomes illegal or impossible.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by acdha on Thursday May 11, 2023 @06:55AM (#35900411)
It’s possible but not legal, just unenforced. We understand that you feel entitled to use things without paying for them but don’t try to dress it up as anything more noble or pretend to be surprised if enforcement escalates.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by CydeWeys on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:28PM (#35896989)
And this is exactly why YouTube should block ad blockers, to force people like you to be honest.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by kingrazor on Thursday May 11, 2023 @12:02AM (#35897261)
I fail to see how I'm being dishonest. It's not like I'm lying about how I use it.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by CydeWeys on Thursday May 11, 2023 @04:08PM (#35907716)
Today you get to learn that words can have multiple definitions!
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by mike741 on Thursday May 11, 2023 @06:48PM (#35909385)
That kinda sounds like lying.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by judge2020 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:11PM (#35896889)
And thus YouTube is experimenting with an ad-blocker detection mechanism.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by xigoi on Thursday May 11, 2023 @12:51AM (#35897679)
I'd gladly watch the content somewhere else if Google wasn't holding a monopoly over it.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by acdha on Thursday May 11, 2023 @06:57AM (#35900424)
Good news, they aren’t. Tons of content is on multiple services - if you really have a principled objection to Google, you should show that by supporting those services rather than boosting YouTube’s popularity.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by mike741 on Thursday May 11, 2023 @06:52PM (#35909422)
"Tons of content on multiple services" =/= "Tons of alternative services"

There is only one viable alternative to Youtube that I'm aware of. I use it whenever I can, but that doesn't change the fact that Youtube holds a monopoly.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by jimbob45 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:26PM (#35896576)
The videos are usually sponsored with the ads pushed by the streamer themselves. They’re getting paid just fine. YouTube freely steals my data so they’re doing just fine. I’m just being gaslit into thinking I’m a thief.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @10:27PM (#35896580)
How does YouTube steal your data? What do they do with it?
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by dendriti on Thursday May 11, 2023 @01:50AM (#35898151)
If you don't know the answer to this yourself, why would you take it upon yourself to shill for them?
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by Mindwipe on Thursday May 11, 2023 @04:05AM (#35899224)
It's called a rhetorical question.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by mike741 on Thursday May 11, 2023 @07:05PM (#35909523)
They track and sell it to undisclosed 3rd parties
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by pb7 on Friday May 12, 2023 @12:58PM (#35918875)
Citation needed. No they don't.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by mike741 on Friday May 12, 2023 @05:00PM (#35922328)
Of course they do.

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2020/03/google-says-it-doesnt-...

https://policies.google.com/privacy?hl=en-US

> Parties with whom information may be disclosed: Service providers, trusted businesses or persons that process information on Google’s behalf

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by acdha on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:03PM (#35896823)
If you were actually worried about YouTube stealing your data, why do you keep giving it to them by using their service? Wouldn’t the smart move be to stop visiting?
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by mike741 on Thursday May 11, 2023 @07:08PM (#35909550)
It's a simple value estimate. Some things, at least in the moment, appear to be worth having some of your data stolen. Also there are measures that can be taken, such as using adblockers, that minimize the cost.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by acdha on Thursday May 11, 2023 @08:25PM (#35910277)
How is data being “stolen”? All of the data they collect is data which you are freely giving them by using their service, and ad blockers really don't prevent any of that: you're connecting to a Google server telling them where you live, what type of device you use, and what you're interested in. An ad blocker prevents you from seeing ads but it doesn't do anything to prevent resale of the data you volunteer.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by mike741 on Friday May 12, 2023 @03:29AM (#35913098)
> How is data being “stolen”?

You tell me, I was responding to your hypothetical question: "If you were actually worried about YouTube stealing your data, why do you keep giving it to them by using their service?"

>An ad blocker prevents you from seeing ads but it doesn't do anything to prevent resale of the data you volunteer

True. That's why I still volunteer as little data as possible.

Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by xigoi on Thursday May 11, 2023 @12:52AM (#35897684)
The creators wouldn't get anything either if I didn't block the ads, because I don't click on ads.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by Mindwipe on Thursday May 11, 2023 @04:04AM (#35899212)
That's not how any of this works.
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by dendriti on Thursday May 11, 2023 @01:49AM (#35898148)
Anti-piracy folks love to use bullshit loaded terms (such as "piracy" itself) to justify some megacorporation taking over shit on my computer. Adblocking is now "cheating"?`
Re:YouTube tests blocking videos unless you disable ad blockers by acdha on Thursday May 11, 2023 @07:00AM (#35900453)
Speaking of loaded terms, what are they “taking over” by showing an ad along with the content? If you truly believed they posed the risk that incorrect terminology implies, why on earth would you continue using the site and giving them more opportunities to do so?