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Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by harry8 on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @01:47AM (#35257284)
> Wrong. This is corruption. Janet is picking winners and losers. Some people are losing their deposits and some are not. You are systemic if you had dinner with Janet yesterday.

Big call. Huge. Got some data or similar to back it?

Edit: If there's clear picking of winners, or even plausibly so it's gonna look pretty bad. [1]

[1] https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jan/01/janet-yelle...

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by nugget on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @02:02AM (#35257369)
Watch the exchange between Sen Lankford and Sec Yellen yourself:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bcvl104tyRY

Yellen says unsecured depositors at TBTF banks will always be bailed out, but those at smaller banks are on their own. It's one of the most incredible moments I've witnessed. I'm not sure if there's some hidden agenda being pursued, or if Yellen is just so far removed from the real world that she doesn't understand the consequences of her statement.

I'm not sure why any company or individual would hold >$250k at a non-TBTF bank after this. It borders on financial malpractice.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by somenameforme on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @03:03AM (#35257739)
I never understand things like this. She looks like a deer caught in the headlights when he asks her the most predictable and basic question about her decisions. How can you be in such a position, make such decisions, and be unable to offer a compelling answer to the most basic questions?

Even if it some sort of a hidden agenda and [further] centralizing banking is just seen as a convenient stepping stone towards CBDCs or whatever, you'd come up with some passable explanation ahead of time. I mean it's not like the Senator there pulled out some gotcha she couldn't have expected.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by skellington on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @03:36AM (#35257957)
I think you know the answer to this. People at that level are put their for political reasons, not for competency. This is the Biden administration, peak nepotism. Probably a Republican president would be just as bad, but currently it is Biden.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by jquery on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @03:55AM (#35258080)
>Probably a Republican president would be just as bad

Yes we all know the previous President famously kept his family far away from the levers of power.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by hanselot on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @04:17AM (#35258218)
This is accurate. Don't you know his son had an infamous laptop that exposed all of his illicit dealings with Ukraine, never mind the straight up insane things regarding their family affairs.

I mean, if there was ever a time to know the people supporting the current regime are in a cult, look no further.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by SkyMarshal on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @04:15AM (#35258195)
You keep using that word nepotism. I do not think it means what you think it means. It’s not like Biden hired his daughter and son-in-law to bring peace to the Middle East and modernize the US govt among other tasks.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by the_gipsy on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @05:36AM (#35258726)
Peak nepotism? Really?
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by nkrisc on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @06:04AM (#35258909)
You can make a point about the administration, but if you’re talking about nepotism, specifically, you’re making a point about the wrong administration. There’s a much better example of a recent administration engaging in “peak nepotism”, a recent one that had the president’s children working in the White House.

I’m assuming the point you’re trying to make isn’t actually about nepotism and you’ve simply misunderstood what the word means.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by AnimalMuppet on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @09:29AM (#35260690)
That's not peak nepotism. Peak nepotism would be family members on the Cabinet or the Supreme Court.

Like, say, John F. Kennedy's brother.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by nkrisc on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @11:11AM (#35262238)
Sure. I wasn’t trying to declare which administration was “peak nepotism”, only that calling the current one so is disingenuous when you have only to look as far as the previous one to find one that was more so.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by prennert on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @04:12AM (#35258176)
There is a concept in the armed forces for making decisions in a given timeframe (struggling to find a source for this). Essentially you do the best you can in the time you are given. Then you move on and iterate. If you dither too much you probably don't have to make a decision anymore as the enemy has made it for you. In that framework it is accepted that a solution is not perfect.

I think about these crises the same way. They had 48h to sort it out and they had to make a decision. The decision has side-effect-like consequences. Should she now lie about this?

So now, why did they only have 48h to make a decision? I don't know. I doubt nobody has thought about this before. But I assume that regulating banks is particularly hard, because of lobby pushback and the banks ability to exploit any loop hole quickly. They are literally organisations that look out for how to make money by exploiting asymmetries. These organisations work against the slow democratic decision making that involves non-aligned actors (who are also often not trained in this particular issue) in the upper and lower houses of parliaments of different countries.

Another question is. Why are small banks treated differently than big banks. I have read somewhere that small banks have less regulatory oversight. Maybe the decision is much more to support heavily regulated banks and not so much those which are for various reasons not as much regulated. Why would the government want to hold the bag that it was not allowed to look into?

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by scrlk on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @04:59AM (#35258516)
> There is a concept in the armed forces for making decisions in a given timeframe (struggling to find a source for this).

OODA loop? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OODA_loop

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by samus on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @08:03AM (#35259768)
I was thinking the same. But it sounds more like how to prevent being OODAed by someone else.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by throwaway049 on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @06:01AM (#35258886)
They had 48h in this case, but who gets bailed out and on what terms is a massive strategic decision that should not be made on the hoof. I must be naive because I thought planning for this kind of problem was part of her job.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by prennert on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @09:26AM (#35260665)
First up, I do not have any particular insights what happened behind the doors and how government planning _really_ works. But if business / engineering management is in any way similar, there would have been a huge amount of uncertainty at the moment the hand was forced.

One would hope that there were some specialists at hand that know parts of the system, laws, implications on the overall economy etc.

There are likely a couple of plans available how to deal with this kind of situation. But likely not for this exact situation. Plans that exist but have not been implemented as policy likely are too rough around the edges or have significant opposition for different reasons.

On top of this, at this level of complexity and abstraction everything is kind of an opinion until tested and proven (but no time for that). Because no one truly understands all details and system connections.

On top of this in government you never know 100% what the motivations behind all these suggestions and plans is. What is factual, and what is politically tainted.

So all of the sudden things turn from certain to probabilistic. The leader has to figure out how to weigh the opinions and how to make a coherent enough decision (remember this is a system, and individually good decisions can be bad when taken together) to be net positive until the structured decision making can catch up.

Hopefully this is what is happening now and a general policy is decided on based on structured analysis. And hopefully it is quick enough to be ready before the next crisis hits.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by AnimalMuppet on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @09:23AM (#35260618)
Why did they only have 48 hours to make a decision? Because the banks (and the financial markets) were going to re-open on Monday morning.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by revelio on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @06:46AM (#35259206)
>> you'd come up with some passable explanation ahead of time

Central bankers are appointed based on two criteria:

1. A willingness to print money for the government so it can spend more than it raises in taxes.

2. Looking presentable, sounding sophisticated and emitting enough bafflegab that (1) seems scientific instead of ideological.

Thinking deeply about economics and the role of banking/central banks in society is an anti criteria, because if you did think about those things you'd end up concluding that the only fair and stable solution is way less money printing and quite possibly none. That would directly undermine the government that appoints you. Your salary depends on you not understanding your own area of specialism.

I do feel like the defining characteristic of the 2020s is turning out to be people's struggle to accept the horrible truth that government officials/scientists who claim to be experts systematically have no idea what they are doing.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by markus_zhang on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @08:04AM (#35259777)
Maybe it's a question not supposed to ask. They all know the answer but it's inconvenient to answer before the public.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by theteapot on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @04:34AM (#35258337)
> Yellen says unsecured depositors at TBTF banks will always be bailed out, but those at smaller banks are on their own.

I agree SVB and Signature uninsured deposits shouldn't have been guaranteed, but that's not quite what Yellen said. The $250K guarantee applies to deposits at all insured banks. Having clarified that, Yellen said:

> A bank only gets that treatment [guaranteeing all deposits] if a [super] majority of the FDIC, a super majority of the FED board, and I in consultation with the president determine that the failure to protect uninsured depositors would create a systemic risk and significant economic and and financial consequences ...

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by boomerango on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @07:33AM (#35259500)
Exactly. The subtext to this clip is that she cannot do what the congressman is acting without an act of congress, and he should know that. It’s well executed grandstanding.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by boomerango on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @07:31AM (#35259487)
As I understand it, the piece you are missing is that she legally/procedurally cannot guarantee depositors prior to a bankruptcy - that would require an act of congress. The congressman know this as well, so it’s just grandstanding.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by csomar on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @01:54AM (#35257328)
You don't need a direct financial kickback to define corruption.

From: https://www.cnbc.com/2023/03/16/svb-signature-bank-failures-...

> Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen told senators that government refunds of uninsured deposits will not be extended to every bank that fails, only those that pose systemic risk to the financial system.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by christophilus on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @02:52AM (#35257669)
If you’re too big to fail, you’re too big to exist. We should either let them fail (my preference, despite the pain) or bail them all out. But I also think that if we’re going to insist that there is a private entity that is too big to fail, it should be broken up until the pieces are not too big to fail.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by piva00 on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @03:13AM (#35257807)
Or it shouldn't be a private entity.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by robertlagrant on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @03:48AM (#35258027)
Better a private entity that needs bailing out with taxpayer money than one that is normally funded by taxpayers.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by hutzlibu on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @05:41AM (#35258746)
Socialise the risks, privatise profit.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by robertlagrant on Monday March 27, 2023 @03:50AM (#35324010)
To be clear: I think we shouldn't socialise the risks either. Just saying it's better than fully running it on taxpayer money.
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by di456 on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @03:50AM (#35258046)
Banking is basically nationalized now.

The government outsourced this responsibility to the Federal Reserve at the same time that a federal income tax began.

There are 3 main ways to balance a government budget. Spend less, raise more funds through taxes, or make the scale of debt decrease through inflation.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by SturgeonsLaw on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @04:34AM (#35258342)
> Banking is basically nationalized now.

More like government is privatized

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by marcus0x62 on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @08:40AM (#35260112)
¿Por que no los dos?
Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by nashashmi on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @06:24AM (#35259044)
Actually svb did fail. And flunk. The shareholders are wiped out. The employees are gone. Saving the depositors is an act of charity.

And if you save one bank, it restores confidence in the other banks against a bank run. Otherwise I was thinking of removing money in all banks combined.

Re:America’s banks are missing hundreds of billions of dollars by wrenky on Wednesday March 22, 2023 @01:34PM (#35264381)
Yellen just repeated the exact federal reserve policy, like every treasury sec/federal reserve chairman has done since forever. Kinda wild to define that as corruption, but to each their own.

Instead, why don't you look at how many people have lost uninsured deposits since the FDIC was created in 1933? You'll find its extremely low to nonexistent. Thats because while the FDIC has a 250k insurance limit, it does its absolute best to not use it- Usually by coordinating a bank sale or private-public rescue plan.