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Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by Swizec on Saturday February 25, 2023 @01:05PM (#34938841)
The tree makes air move, but you need a subjective experience to turn that into sound.
Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by Sebb767 on Saturday February 25, 2023 @01:35PM (#34939177)
That depends on whether you define sound as air waves/vibration or the sensation of hearing. Definitions vary [1,2,3], which is why this philosophical question manages to get people talking past each other.

[1] https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sound

[2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound

[3] https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/sound (note that "can be heard" != "is heard")

Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by sidlls on Saturday February 25, 2023 @01:44PM (#34939258)
Then it's not a philosophical question so much as about the meaning of "sound". And "debates" about semantics are about as uninteresting as it gets.
Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by Sebb767 on Saturday February 25, 2023 @01:53PM (#34939326)
A lot of "philosophical" questions boil down to semantic debates, see the sleeping beauty problem for another one [1]. So we can get into a philosophical (or semantic?) debate about that, for a funny instance of recursion :-)

But I agree with that those debates are quite uninteresting, so let's not do that.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleeping_Beauty_problem

Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by mistermann on Saturday February 25, 2023 @03:12PM (#34939984)
> And "debates" about semantics are about as uninteresting as it gets.

A 'fact' that is relative to the frame of reference of the observer.

Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by sidlls on Saturday February 25, 2023 @04:16PM (#34940580)
Nah, there’s nothing less interesting and more irritating than bikeshedding if that sort. Nobody cares about some blowhard’s attempt to generate pointless “debate” over hypotheticals and semantics.
Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by mistermann on Sunday February 26, 2023 @01:28PM (#34947955)
> Nah, there’s nothing less interesting and more irritating than bikeshedding of that sort.

When you say "there’s nothing less interesting and more irritating than", are you speaking universally, or of your own personal experience?

> Nobody cares about some blowhard’s attempt to generate pointless “debate” over hypotheticals and semantics.

How do you people have knowledge of each others thoughts? Serious question.

Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by ctoth on Saturday February 25, 2023 @01:46PM (#34939270)
Did... Did this actually just happen for real?

https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/a7n8GdKiAZRX86T5A/making-bel...

Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by Sebb767 on Saturday February 25, 2023 @01:54PM (#34939329)
Well, I guess there's always https://xkcd.com/1053/
Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by anonymouskimmer on Saturday February 25, 2023 @04:01PM (#34940418)
I don't get why you're posting this in a surprised manner. Yes, these philosophical debates have been happening for many, many years (and when they do happen they often happen with famous philosophical questions such as the tree-forest-sound one). Yudkowsky wasn't making a novel philosophical discovery, he was just putting particular philosophical debates and meta-debates together into an essay.
Re:Mysterious object is being dragged into the black hole at... by astrange on Saturday February 25, 2023 @09:48PM (#34942569)
I'm sorry you accidentally joined an internet cult, but Yud did not invent philosophy, especially not Wittgenstein.