News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by flippinburgers on Sunday January 01, 2023 @06:24PM (#34212235)
I find the unatonable original sin spin placed on white people these days in the USA to be a tad bit repulsive personally.
Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by BuckRogers on Monday January 02, 2023 @12:34AM (#34214722)
And that’s why the Proud Boys say they’re not apologizing for creating the modern world. And the idea is popular.

To be clear, many Hispanics agree. Many of their ancestors played a role alongside the rest of their fellow whites. Whites are still admired by Asians as well.

This anti-white thing is largely an American phenomenon and other far left folks around the world that are resentful and cannot accept responsibility for their own condition. The rest of them deal with the hand they’re dealt, and go to work. As no one has more influence over their lives than them. We just accept it rather than adopt victimhood as a way of life. That’s how you create losers.

Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by s5300 on Monday January 02, 2023 @12:43AM (#34214774)
Not sure what fantasy you’re living in where a terrorist group (aside from perhaps the U.S. government) is “creating the modern world” lmao

I presume whatever fantasy it is might be a fairly common “master race” one

Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by gadders on Monday January 02, 2023 @08:20AM (#34217545)
The "they" when they say "they" created the modern world is not the membership of the organisation, but rather western civilisation/culture.
Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by Viliam1234 on Monday January 02, 2023 @02:56PM (#34222809)
If it is silly to feel responsible for bad things that other people did, just because they happened to have the same color of skin, it is also silly to take credit for the good things other people did.
Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by BuckRogers on Tuesday January 03, 2023 @01:09AM (#34228325)
Exactly. We can only be proud of what we personally accomplish.

I wasn’t endorsing the Proud Boys, but they aren’t completely without a point either. I’m more concerned victimhood culture is destroying more lives than racism is at this point.

My wife is not a white woman. No one’s going to tell our kids that they’re doomed. I want them to flourish. regardless of circumstances, through grit, persistence, determination, and resilience.

At a certain point, we all need to deal with the hand we’re dealt in life. I certainly was not on the fortunate side of the fence myself.

There’s a reason why a lot of families no longer exist. Tough times came and they put a bullet in their head. We’re heading for tough times again and outcomes will be delineated by who has taught their children strong values.

Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by gadders on Tuesday January 03, 2023 @04:55AM (#34229709)
Well strictly speaking a) they don't say they're proud of it, they say the "refuse to apologise for it" and b) they have ethnic minority members and their leader was afro-cuban (Enrique Tarrio).
Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by BuckRogers on Friday January 06, 2023 @03:57AM (#34272541)
This is true. I am not a Proud Boy expert. I don't support the movement. I just know of them and referenced a line of theirs. But their stance is better nuanced than my recollection was.

I do like the minority inclusion because you don't have to be white to be Christian, support a modern law-abiding civilization, or generally do "what works". I'm white but my wife is Mexican. We're both very conservative in most ways. Her family is proud of the Christian conquest of Latin America and don't think they went far enough in the conquest. Far beyond the typical liberal American view of boo hoo for the "natives". Americans are not aware that many hispanics are more conservative than they think. The racial purity thing is not going to be very productive going forward. The Proud Boys were a model for the future in that regard.

What the boat is sailing on now though are Greco-Roman values, which is the basis of western civilization. Which is kind of important since the east tends to rely on oppression. Look at Russia and China today.

Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by pstuart on Monday January 02, 2023 @12:49AM (#34214810)
To be clear, are you saying that white people are supposed to feel bad for being white because of "bad things" done by white people?
Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by flippinburgers on Monday January 02, 2023 @02:30AM (#34215319)
That is the underlying tone that comes across to me whenever these subjects come up. Effectively pushing against the idea makes one a "racist" or a "white supremacist" as far as I can tell. I don't know how to respond to that kind of labeling because I don't find myself disliking people because of something as superficial as their skin color.
Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by pstuart on Monday January 02, 2023 @05:22PM (#34224508)
> Effectively pushing against the idea makes one a "racist" or a "white supremacist" as far as I can tell.

Your wording is a wee bit vague. There's nothing wrong about pushing back on the notion that if one is white than one is guilty of crimes committed in the name of white superiority (because that's actually racist too).

But it also doesn't discount the fact that racism is still very much a problem.

Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by flippinburgers on Monday January 02, 2023 @07:39PM (#34225922)
I am not vague. What is vague is the shadowy threat of being called a racist for stating ones opinion while having the wrong color of skin. It is a problem. Just a wee bit.
Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by pstuart on Monday January 02, 2023 @11:18PM (#34227608)
I'm sorry -- that wasn't intended as an insult, more of an issue on me being able to ascertain exactly what you were saying. Comprehending other people's writing can be challenging at times even if you think you know what they're saying.

One's opinion should stand on the words/ideas behind them, not what one looks like. Getting called out for that is bullshit and should be disregarded.

Part of my confusion is also that I don't feel the threat that you mention. I'm also okay with being challenged and with being wrong. I think the key is to try to engage with respect and be prepared to listen to what the other party is trying to say -- and assume best intentions.

Re:Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first ... by flippinburgers on Thursday January 05, 2023 @01:15AM (#34256692)
I fully agree with you about ideas standing on their merits. I hope we continue to move in that direction as a species.