ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law

Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by mcronce on Thursday November 17, 2022 @10:43PM (#33649877)

ASML depends on lenses from a relatively small company. That company does not have interest in ramping production any more than they already have. They don't care how much money they're offered.

Nobody else can get the job done. So, as they say, it is what it is.

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by yucky on Thursday November 17, 2022 @10:57PM (#33650024)

Which company?

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by snazz on Thursday November 17, 2022 @10:58PM (#33650040)

Zeiss.

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by yucky on Friday November 18, 2022 @07:28AM (#33653643)

I believe ASML actually owns a huge chunk of Zeiss, no?

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by drlobster on Friday November 18, 2022 @08:19AM (#33654150)

ASML own 24.9% of ZEISS SMT, the part of ZEISS which makes the lenses for them.

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by KingLancelot on Friday November 18, 2022 @12:11AM (#33650639)

Zeiss isn’t small lol

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by ChuckNorris89 on Friday November 18, 2022 @03:26AM (#33651879)

It's small by HN/SV tech company standards where companies grow 2000% in workforce per year just to show growth to investors.

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by Cthulhu_ on Friday November 18, 2022 @05:03AM (#33652627)

Workforce or valuation? It's no secret that these tech companies are over-inflated, at least recently there seems to have been a correction. Companies like Zeiss are much more solid at least.

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by ChuckNorris89 on Friday November 18, 2022 @07:37AM (#33653729)

Both in workforce and valuation. Companies like Zeiss have slower but more sustainable growth, but also don't move fast and break things.

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by smueller1234 on Friday November 18, 2022 @01:45AM (#33651196)

€ 2.298 billion (2020/21) revenue

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Zeiss_SMT

15 years ago, when I was there, Zeiss SMT also did the light sources (discussed elsewhere in the thread), btw, not just supplying the lenses. Don't know if that's still the case. I don't know exactly what the lens/mirror systems for EUV look like, but the "old" 193nm ones were something to behold.

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by WeylandYutani on Friday November 18, 2022 @07:33AM (#33653692)

Only a state actor could threaten ASML dominance at this point. They have outlasted all their commercial rivals.

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by bogomipz on Friday November 18, 2022 @07:03PM (#33664855)

Who were ASML rivals? How long ago did they have viable competition?

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by detaro on Friday November 18, 2022 @07:12PM (#33664947)

Canon and Nikon, but they've not managed to get EUV machines on the market (and I'm not sure how much they're investing in trying again).

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Re:ASML looking to finally get ahead of Moore’s Law by sveme on Friday November 18, 2022 @10:25AM (#33656026)

Zeiss has more than just SMT (the guys that build the EUV mirrors), they have consumer products, a medical technology arm and one that is working on optical quality assurance and research microscopy. Alltogether 40k employees and around 6 or 7 billion Euros of annual revenue. Small on a global scale, but not that small. Great company for engineers, by the way.

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