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Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by worker767424 on Friday November 11, 2022 @02:52AM (#33558262)
I keep waiting for a law enforcement death due to a no-knock raid. With gun ownership in the US, it's only a matter of time before someone shoots someone they assume was a burglar, and since it was no-knock, just saying "FBI" isn't really enough. Anyone can break into a home and say "FBI."
Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by seo-speedwagon on Friday November 11, 2022 @03:11AM (#33558350)
From a decade ago, cops bust into a guy’s house and he unloads on them. Fully acquitted

https://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local/article/Man-who-shot...

Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by derwiki on Friday November 11, 2022 @07:53AM (#33560212)
Isn’t this essentially what happened with Breonna Taylor?
Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by PaulWaldman on Friday November 11, 2022 @08:14AM (#33560426)
There were no LE deaths related to Breonna Taylor.
Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by puffoflogic on Friday November 11, 2022 @12:50PM (#33564099)
One of them got a boo boo though and that justifies murdering anyone else they ever encounter.
Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by jjeaff on Friday November 11, 2022 @11:30AM (#33562844)
One law enforcement officer was hit in the leg. They had a "No knock warrant" but then have testified that they knocked and identified themselves as police before breaking down the door in plainclothes. Color me unconvinced.

They then proceeded to basically cover their eyes and shoot 32 shots while spinning around blindly like Barney Fife, hit Breonna Taylor 6 times as well as firing shots through a random glass door to the patio and miraculously didn't kill or hit anyone else in the apartment complex.

Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by Volundr on Thursday November 17, 2022 @11:11AM (#33640975)
> then have testified that they knocked and identified themselves as police before breaking down the door in plainclothes.

Over a dozen neighbors, including one outside smoking near the incident, interviewed said they never heard the police identify themselves. Only one neighborhood claims to have heard them do so.

"Unconvinced" is right. If they identified themselves they did a piss poor job.

And seriously, why would you ever want to do a "plain clothes" no knock raid?

Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by giantg2 on Thursday November 17, 2022 @12:40PM (#33642588)
They lied to the judge to get the warrant. Would it surprise anyone that they lied about other things?
Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by ethbr0 on Thursday November 17, 2022 @12:40PM (#33642593)
> And seriously, why would you ever want to do a "plain clothes" no knock raid?

Because you're serving a warrant on a dangerous suspect, who you have reason to believe has community support? (e.g. someone on the corner who's going to tip the suspect off when the lookout sees the cops rolling up)

Which isn't me justifying the Breonna Taylor raid, which by all accounts appears to have been an end-to-end clusterfuck, compounded with actual lying before and after the raid and a criminally negligent lack of weapons discipline by the officers involved.

That should have never been signed off on.

But there are scenarios where law enforcement are serving warrants on violent people, who if tipped off ahead of time increase the risk to the officers, the suspect, and the community around them.

As with many application-of-force vs freedom scenarios, it's a fuzzy justification line, but there's a line somewhere.

Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by Volundr on Thursday November 17, 2022 @01:26PM (#33643329)
> Because you're serving a warrant on a dangerous suspect, who you have reason to believe has community support?

This feels like a contradiction to me. If the suspect is perceived dangerous enough that we need the no knock, surely they are also dangerous enough we need to be prepared for strong, armed resistance right? Body armor, shields etc? All things that are decidedly not 'plain clothes".

I mean if they have that much community support that you are afraid someone will see you coming and tip them off, are you also not afraid that once you've kicked this person's door down you've now got hostiles both inside AND outside?

Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by cochne on Thursday November 17, 2022 @01:36PM (#33643463)
It might be more about preventing them from destroying evidence.
Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by ethbr0 on Thursday November 17, 2022 @02:32PM (#33644362)
SWAT teams are one option, but they're not the only option. Sometimes surprise might be more beneficial.

Presumably not even the police want to be shooting it out in the middle of an apartment complex.

And I guess the general calculus is that even the most aggressive neighborhood bystanders in America are usually less dangerous than a criminal suspect.

But it speaks to the contradiction: the entire point of a no-knock is surprise.

But legal, authorized surprise is practically incompatible with the second amendment (as currently interpreted) and stand your ground laws (as increasingly being passed).

So... that leaves us in the ugliness of reality.

Re:FBI In No-Knock Raid on Area 51 Website Operator by HDThoreaun on Thursday November 17, 2022 @11:43AM (#33641527)
I thought there was video of the incident. Why do we need to take anyones word for it?