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Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by downrightmike on Sunday October 09, 2022 @11:43PM (#33147535)
Even in a cheap area in a western red state, last year, flippers bought a house, slapped a for sale sign and doubled the price the next month. Those are still sitting unsold. And now houses are being bought by flippers who are slapping an extra 2.5 times the price they got it for in the same month. None of these houses are selling. Just sitting empty.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by Animats on Sunday October 09, 2022 @11:59PM (#33147640)
That sort of thing should end with the end of low interest rates. When interest rates were near zero, borrowing money to purchase unused real estate could be profitable if you could sell some of it. No longer true.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by bobthepanda on Monday October 10, 2022 @12:25AM (#33147778)
Right, unless those flippers paid with straight cash, they are going to have a hard time raising more money to buy more houses, and they might go underwater on the current ones.

To see what that looks like on steroids, China's economy is at real risk of recession due to property developers running out of cash and failing to build promised developments. (Most apartments in China are purchased before construction starts, so you can buy a house and not end up with one in the end.)

Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by edmundsauto on Monday October 10, 2022 @10:21AM (#33151764)
Even if investors pay cash, they need cheap interest rates to be able to sell at a profit to people who need a loan.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by wil421 on Monday October 10, 2022 @06:37AM (#33149791)
The average time to flip a house is 45 days to 6 months. Let’s pretend it’s going to cost $500 more a month in interest rates, that’s only $3000 more dollars. If you could do 3 in a year you’ll only lose about $10k.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by WirelessGigabit on Monday October 10, 2022 @01:07AM (#33147977)
I wish the tax on flipping houses went up. Something is sleeping there that it economically makes sense. Like if I sell 1 car, ok, but if I sell 10 I need a dealer license. Same should happen with the flippers. More regulations, because they’re cutting corners all the way.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by joe-collins on Monday October 10, 2022 @03:19AM (#33148683)
Rather than targeting flipping, I think ownership of more than one housing unit should be taxed progressively and become prohibitive rapidly.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by sokoloff on Monday October 10, 2022 @04:51AM (#33149239)
Do you feel that renters should be punished economically (which I think would be an inevitable consequence of that policy)?
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by KptMarchewa on Monday October 10, 2022 @05:48AM (#33149529)
I think amount of renters would rapidly drop off.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by sokoloff on Monday October 10, 2022 @05:57AM (#33149578)
I agree. Some to ownership. Others to homelessness.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by KptMarchewa on Monday October 10, 2022 @06:42AM (#33149823)
It depends on what facilities the country would provide. Assuming it's USA it's homelessness. If it was another country, it might be provided social housing.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by JumpCrisscross on Monday October 10, 2022 @09:57AM (#33151471)
Why not skip the taxation and homelessness and just build the social housing?
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by KptMarchewa on Monday October 10, 2022 @01:00PM (#33153809)
That's also an option, however, it does not remove enough profits from land ownership rent seeking.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by JumpCrisscross on Tuesday October 11, 2022 @01:05AM (#33159717)
> it does not remove enough profits from land ownership rent seeking

You'd prefer to create excess misery to satisfy a sense of vengeance? Versus just solving the problem?

Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by KptMarchewa on Tuesday October 11, 2022 @07:03AM (#33161817)
Land ownership rent seeking creates misery. It should be curbed.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by colinmhayes on Monday October 10, 2022 @09:59AM (#33151491)
What should people that expect/hope to move soon do?
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by carom on Monday October 10, 2022 @03:00PM (#33155209)
What should young and poor people who can't afford a down payment do?
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by colinmhayes on Monday October 10, 2022 @03:30PM (#33155497)
rent...
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by sokoloff on Monday October 10, 2022 @09:49PM (#33158545)
I think /u/carom agrees with you (that renting is the best choice for many), even if they don't realize it.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by everforward on Monday October 10, 2022 @11:52AM (#33152956)
It's worth considering that some of us want to rent. I've moved for work a few times, so I rented because it wasn't worth the hassle of buying a house, living in it for 2 years, then selling it to move. Some people move to a big city to start a career, with the intentions of moving back towards home when they've cut their teeth.

Having the option to rent is a good thing, being forced to rent when you don't want to is a bad thing. Hopefully we can accommodate both.

Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by carom on Monday October 10, 2022 @02:58PM (#33155179)
Under your scheme, if I own a property, it is cheaper for me to make it a single family home than to subdivide it into multiple units? Why are you punishing who make housing available to others?

I rent out one single family home that I couldn't sell when I moved and a 4 unit building where I currently live in one of the units. I never understand these comments. The 4 unit building could be torn down and made a SFH or I could build 14 units which my city desperately needs. If you keep adding rent control and payment vacations and eviction moratoriums and taxes it will be a SFH.

I think your dream is every property is tenancy in commons, but that is legal now and not popular. The reason is zoning. Rich people can compete with two families easily and by limiting the number of units that is all they need to compete with. Much more difficult to compete with 10 families if the lot is zoned for 10.

Anyway, these policy suggestions are maniacal. Go buy and build housing and you'll see how much work it is. Make a startup that makes TiC and construction easier. Go change zoning laws.

Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by BuckRogers on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @08:29PM (#33185660)
Making construction easier just makes those guys lives easier, I doubt it'll result in more housing. Look at the red states with no regulations like Louisiana. They're terrible places to live. Nothing gets fixed with no/low regulation.

I do think his idea about high taxes on a 2nd+ home makes sense. The only problem with it is that it doesn't apply globally, only nationally. You'll have rich people have a palace in the US, Spain, and Australia instead of 3 in the US.

For my own life and approach to this, I moved around a lot and lived in austerity saving up money for a home. I don't want zoning laws to change at all because there's already too many multi-tenant buildings. Pull up the sex and gun offender maps, it's disproportionately those people. And I'm currently a tenant myself (while obeying the laws and having a clean record).

I'd rather see taxes on 2nd+ homes than zoning change. We already built 'out' with suburbs and have plenty of land available for developers to build on and make money. With the internet we no longer have to all live in a city either. It seems to me like his idea, minus the global snag, is generally on the right track.

But I am not a fan of multi-tenant housing near whatever home I purchase, just because of the sort of short-sighted people that often make up renters. They should be in homes anyway, not renting, in an ideal scenario.

Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by downrightmike on Monday October 10, 2022 @07:29PM (#33157595)
Both. And IRS penalties.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by gremlinsinc on Monday October 10, 2022 @04:37AM (#33149164)
I think Airbnb rentals need to be curtailed.

I'm my county there are 65k people. It's also the largest county by size in Utah Iirc, in my city which is the biggest city in the county there's around 40k.

When we had to move it was horrifying and scary trying to find a place. There seemed to be no vacancies. Someone posted a listing on Facebook marketplace and there were 20 replies in under 5 minutes.

However, the are 400 apartments that used to presumably be college(we're a college town) or regular residential homes.

So the irksome thing is the fear of being homeless is very real even if you have money to move to another place, there aren't any. But there's 400 places that could be available which would raise supply if short term rentals were banned or taxed steeply enough that revenue for short term might only be 500 more per month instead of 3000 more.

This is happening everywhere not just my part of fantasia.

Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by astrange on Monday October 10, 2022 @03:59AM (#33148931)
They don't have infinite money to do this, not anymore. Eventually the market's going to clear or they're going out of business.

Although in my experience people are convinced there's "vacant houses" absolutely everywhere based on not seeing the lights on at night. It's not true and this is not a major contribution to the housing crisis.

Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by huijzer on Monday October 10, 2022 @05:38PM (#33156685)
This is also a nice description of the stock market over the last few years. Buy high and quickly sell higher. Works great until the music stops.
Re:Made in America is back, leaving US factories scrambling ... by Fatnino on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @03:14AM (#33173848)
https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/303-Atherton-Ave-Atherton...

Scroll down to price and tax history.

This house has been on the market for at least 15 months and has had its price slashed by over 3 million dollars and nobody is nibbling.

It's become a bit of a running joke around here, trying to guess if it's still the most expensive listing in the local paper each week.

As an aside, the local papers are really just pages and pages of real estate ads with a few paragraphs of news sprinkled here and there. Can literally rip out half the pages and not lose a single line of news.