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Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by foofoo4u on Thursday September 15, 2022 @01:22PM (#32855381)
In the filing, it states

> As you all know, we are committed to becoming an Anti-Racist/Anti-Oppression company. Layoffs like this can have a more pronounced impact on marginalized communities, so we were particularly focused on ensuring our layoffs – while a business necessity today – were carried out through an Anti-Racist/Anti-Oppression lens.

What does it mean to layoff through an, "Anti-Racist/Anti-Oppression lens"?

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by TheBigSalad on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:28PM (#32856346)
Making sure you aren't disproportionately firing people of a certain race for reasons other than performance. For example, maybe a particular dept you don't need is coincidentally in an area with more black people and is disproportionately black. You might let go of people in other departments and transfer some of the minority employees. Or maybe you just fire people randomly. You at least look at your list and make sure it's not disproportionately one race or full of minorities, and if it is, find out why.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by polski-g on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:32PM (#32856420)
It is unlawful to even consider protected characteristics in any employment decision. You can't look at characteristics for hiring, firing, promoting, not promoting, or even transferring.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by chadash on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:37PM (#32856504)
I am skeptical that a company the size of Twilio wouldn't run this by employment lawyers first. Do you have any sources to cite here?
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by anvic on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:47PM (#32856673)
All companies run everything by their lawyers and still they are found doing illegal stuff from time to time.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by chadash on Thursday September 15, 2022 @03:20PM (#32857202)
Of course. Sometimes companies do things that are blatantly illegal and they know it. Usually they don't put these things down in SEC filings. For example, I'm sure that many hedge funds routinely trade on insider information and know that what they are doing is illegal. Most are smart enough not to publicize this.

In this case, my point is not that this is legal or illegal. My point is that they probably ran this by their lawyers and at the very least those lawyers probably said "yeah, you have a reasonable case if this goes to court". If the lawyers said "yeah, this is definitely illegal, you are going to get sued, it's an easy case and you are going to lose", then sure, it's possible that Twilio decided to do this anyway, but I don't see that as likely. They probably have at least a legal theory on why this is permissible.

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by the_doctah on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:43PM (#32856595)
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by chadash on Thursday September 15, 2022 @03:22PM (#32857237)
"The U.S. Supreme Court has recognized an exception to Title VII’s protections from discrimination in industries where employers can establish a historical imbalance or disparity in the workforce. In United Steelworkers of America, AFL-CIO-CLC v. Weber, 443 US 193 (1979), the Supreme Court considered an affirmative action program that was implemented to increase the amount of black skilled craft workers. Half of the positions in the training program were reserved for black workers. Because this training scheme was intended to eliminate longstanding patterns of racial segregation and Title VII “did not inten[d] to prohibit the private sector from taking effective steps” to ensure the goal to prevent discrimination was implemented, the program was upheld. This same theory was applied to the underrepresentation of women in Johnson v. Transp. Agency, Santa Clara Cnty., Cal., 480 U.S. 616 (1987). A male worker had challenged the agency’s selection of a female worker over him. Here, the court upheld the Santa Clara County Transportation Agency’s plan to “achieve a statistically measurable yearly improvement in hiring and promoting minorities and women in job classification where they are underrepresented.” Where no specific number or quota was required but short-range goals were implemented and adjusted yearly, the agency could permissibly take sex into account as one factor in deciding whether to promote women."

source: http://www.epspros.com/news-resources/white-papers/2020/the-...

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by KennyBlanken on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:43PM (#32856602)
Checking to make sure you're not illegally discriminating in the layoffs process is not "considering protected characteristics." FFS...

Edit: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32857237

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by crackercrews on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:48PM (#32856702)
You're assuming that being anti-racist just means checking to make sure you're not illegally discriminating.

My guess is someone sues and we'll all find out what exactly constitutes an anti-racist lens.

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by rparet on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:42PM (#32856576)
This is completely untrue. Google “adverse impact hr” for a quick education on this topic.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by the_doctah on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:44PM (#32856623)
Why do you think this phrase, which describes the outcome, makes the action any less illegal?
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by thebradbain on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:45PM (#32856637)
No it’s not. It’s illegal to discriminate based on that consideration. It’s not illegal to take someone’s race, sexuality, or any other protected class into consideration.

When you hire a man, it’s not like you don’t know they’re a man. The issue would be if you ONLY hire men (intentionally or not).

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by ars on Thursday September 15, 2022 @03:02PM (#32856931)
And then what?

What do you do if you only care about performance in decisions, and when you are done you find out you fired more minorities than others?

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by TheBigSalad on Friday September 16, 2022 @06:58AM (#32864491)
I'm not a CEO, but I think if you can prove that it was based on performance, excluding racial factors, then you are good to go. So you think the minorities they hired are disproportionately bad? Even if you are racist you must realize that they probably have fewer minorities than the general population so they already are limited to statistically higher performing people per minority group.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by torstenvl on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:24PM (#32856305)
It means they targeted employees for layoffs based on a protected characteristic, and admitted it in public.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by polski-g on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:30PM (#32856380)
So now they're going to have to write a settlement check to the Whites/Asians they fired, or re-hire them and fire the non-Whites/Asians.

Hilarious.

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by fshbbdssbbgdd on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:27PM (#32856326)
It’s a vague platitude and the devil is in the details. For example, you could implement the policy by sending this instruction to your managers: “Please avoid preferentially keeping people on because you have a connection outside work, for example, a family relation or college fraternity membership.”

Who knows if this would have any effect, but most would agree the attempt is “anti-racist/anti-oppression”.

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by bombcar on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:43PM (#32856603)
It means you hired an anti-racism consultant who charged you probably hundreds of thousands of dollars to tell you that you're anti-racist.

What else would it practically mean?

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by KennyBlanken on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:42PM (#32856575)
If two employees are otherwise equally performing, the company has to lay off one of them....but one would have significantly greater difficulty finding re-employment, that's something they want to consider in the decision of which employee is laid off.

It also probably means they acknowledge that there are extensively proven biases against people of color throughout society, and tried to assure that people were not more likely to be laid off because they were a minority.

Just look at the majority of comments here shouting about how this is discriminatory realize how many people in the tech sector look at a black woman interviewing for a programming job and consciously or unconsciously assume she's gotten as far as she has based off diversity quotas or "woke hiring managers" etc...and thus question her credentials more, scrutinize her background more closely, are pickier about her answers to questions and her solutions to coding problems.

Edit: "people in tech think a black woman interviewing with them is incompetent because of diversity hire initiatives" != "diversity hire initiatives result in incompetent employees" just like all the kids believing in Santa don't make Santa real. Don't use my words to justify your "reverse discrimination" narratives. Outgroup candidats start from "less likely to get hired"; diversity initiatives help push them toward "fair chance in the hiring process."

Edit2: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32857237

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by mizzack on Thursday September 15, 2022 @03:46PM (#32857546)
> If two employees are otherwise equally performing, the company has to lay off one of them....but one would have significantly greater difficulty finding re-employment, that's something they want to consider in the decision of which employee is laid off.

This completely ignores that most companies have their own DEI and ESG based hiring initiatives.

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by KennyBlanken on Thursday September 15, 2022 @05:52PM (#32858938)
The existence of DEI and ESG hiring initiatives doesn't mean an outgroup candidate won't still face a tougher time finding re-employment.

Read through all the outraged comments here (and the other three discussions about this) about "woke" this and "diversity programs are illegal discrimination" that, and tell me with a straight face that because some companies have diversity programs, that minorities in tech have just as much of a fair shot at employment as a white worker.

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by achenatx on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:48PM (#32856697)
thats exactly the problem with quotas and biased hiring. If it exists people will assume any given person was actually less qualified and got in because of the quota.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by protomyth on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:51PM (#32856754)
What does it mean to layoff through an, "Anti-Racist/Anti-Oppression lens"?

Some woke CEO and HR, have come to the belief that they don't have to know anything about the person, their character, value to the company, or history. They can determine worthiness of the employee by a check box in "Race" or what pronouns the worker uses. I suppose its an easy way to express their own guilt without actually hurting themselves. Plus, it makes them a hero at those parties they go to.

Clearly if you name two factors, you are going to consider those two factors and actually be Racist and have Oppression of your own.

I'm just sick of the assumptions of people. I get the feeling when the lawsuits come, the internal e-mails in discovery will confirm my worst fears about how the CEO operated.

Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by mc32 on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:27PM (#32856325)
It means when the HR took the spreadsheet over from the beancounters they UNHID the race/gender columns that legal had set to HIDE, so they could make better decisions on who would get the axe.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by the_doctah on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:29PM (#32856373)
Kind of like how LinkedIn asked me to identify my demographic in order to promote more "equitable" outcomes
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by codefreeordie on Thursday September 15, 2022 @01:43PM (#32855733)
You focus on laying off as many folks from the "Oppressor" class as possible
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by db48x on Thursday September 15, 2022 @02:20PM (#32856233)
They are going to be spending a lot of time and money on wrongful-termination lawsuits.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by codefreeordie on Thursday September 15, 2022 @05:57PM (#32858978)
Probably not. Despite the clarity and obviousness of the statutes, courts have been pretty unwilling to consider discrimination claims put forward by white/male plaintiffs.
Re:Twilio CEO: Layoffs were carried out through an Anti-Raci... by pinewurst on Thursday September 15, 2022 @01:44PM (#32855737)
I’m reminded of the Soviet joke about capitalism being man oppressing man, and socialism the other way around.

Layoffs are almost always unfair in some way. This just tilts the unfairness in another direction.