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Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by breitling on Saturday September 10, 2022 @05:24PM (#32794692)
The founder and CEO, Sridhar Vembu, is very much publically aligned with right wing extremists in India, where he lives.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.thewire.in/article/economy/ac...

Vote with your wallet and your conscience

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by srk_hn on Saturday September 10, 2022 @05:49PM (#32794842)
So India is a population of over 1B, and the US+UK is about 400m.

Why should I assume I know better what the solution is for the problems plaguing a country in a completely different part of the world housing 1/8th the world population while living in the comforts of a 1st world country? Is the CEO advocating for genocide?

Or perhaps we should get off our high horse and shouldn't judge other people for things we cannot possibly understand anything about?

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by heavyset_go on Saturday September 10, 2022 @08:05PM (#32795609)
Experts have been warning about genocide in India[1][2][3] because Hindu nationalists and right-wing extremists in power have been persecuting minorities and stoking anti-Muslim sentiment.

This has directly led to violence and death, as well[4][5]. RSS, the party that held the event the CEO was going to go to, has also be directly attributed to violence against Muslims[6].

Exactly what problems are plaguing the country where the solution is discrimination, violence, death and potentially genocide?

Here's what the political rhetoric looks like, from an article titled "India's Hindu extremists are calling for genocide against Muslims"[3]:

> At a conference in India last month, a Hindu extremist dressed head-to-toe in the religion's holy color, saffron, called on her supporters to kill Muslims and "protect" the country.

> "If 100 of us become soldiers and are prepared to kill 2 million (Muslims), then we will win ... protect India, and make it a Hindu nation," said Pooja Shakun Pandey, a senior member of the right-wing Hindu Mahasabha political party, according to a video of the event.

> Her words and calls for violence from other religious leaders were met with a roar of applause from the large audience, a video from the three-day conference in the northern Indian city of Haridwar shows.

Here's what the actions that stem from the persecution and politics look like[5]:

> The 2020 Delhi riots, or North East Delhi riots, were multiple waves of bloodshed, property destruction, and rioting in North East Delhi, beginning on 23 February 2020 and caused chiefly by Hindu mobs attacking Muslims. Of the 53 people killed, two-thirds were Muslims who were shot, slashed with repeated blows, or set on fire. The dead also included a policeman, an intelligence officer and over a dozen Hindus, who were shot or assaulted. More than a week after the violence had ended, hundreds of wounded were languishing in inadequately staffed medical facilities and corpses were being found in open drains. By mid-March many Muslims had remained missing.

> Muslims were marked as targets for violence. In order to have their religion ascertained, Muslim males—who unlike Hindus are commonly circumcised—were at times forced to remove their lower garments before being brutalised. Among the injuries recorded in one hospital were lacerated genitals. The properties destroyed were disproportionately Muslim-owned and included four mosques, which were set ablaze by rioters. By the end of February, many Muslims had left these neighbourhoods. Even in areas of Delhi untouched by the violence, some Muslims had left for their ancestral villages, fearful for their personal safety in India's capital.

[1] https://www.genocidewatch.com/single-post/india-genocide-eme...

[2] https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2022/1/16/expert-warns-of...

[3] https://www.cnn.com/2022/01/14/asia/india-hindu-extremist-gr...

[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Jawaharlal_Nehru_Universi...

[5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Delhi_riots

[6] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violence_against_Muslims_in_In...

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by karthikk on Sunday September 11, 2022 @05:04AM (#32798044)
Experts cited are Islamic or have Islamic leanings. Can you cite some neutral sources?
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by heavyset_go on Sunday September 11, 2022 @06:57PM (#32804062)
Something tells me you had a knee-jerk reaction to an Al Jazeera URL, and then didn't even bother to read any of the citations.

If you had read them, you would have seen that the experts cited in the CNN article, like Gilles Verniers[1], a Catholic, certainly are not Muslim.

Either way, this is the classic ad hominem fallacy.

[1] https://www.ashoka.edu.in/profile/gilles-verniers/

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by karthikk on Monday September 12, 2022 @07:27AM (#32808534)
i wouldnt trust al jazeera nor cnn as they have a hinduphobic stance. yes, i dont bother even opening their links. case in point - check these sites how much they have spoken about hindu massacres in moplah, bengal or kashmir or any of the innumerable instances of hindus being victims. the answer is most likely zero(dont trust me, do a search), they arent neutral but simply parroting an agenda.

so yea any other sources?

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by heavyset_go on Monday September 12, 2022 @07:36PM (#32818791)
Yeah, I'm not doing your homework for you. If you want to assert that your ad hominem attack on sources is legitimate, instead of engaging with the content of those sources, you're free to prove it. Your feelings on the matter, however, are not proof.
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by fellellor on Saturday September 10, 2022 @11:25PM (#32796565)
> corpses were being found in open drains

Let’s see multiple legitimate sources for this one. Police reports are public too. I’d like to see this confirmed. regional language sources are also fine.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by sgjohnson on Saturday September 10, 2022 @05:34PM (#32794746)
> Vote with your wallet and your conscience

What alternative mail hosting provider do you recommend? Google? Microsoft?

Google, in my humble opinion, is the single biggest evil in the digital world today.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by jacooper on Saturday September 10, 2022 @06:07PM (#32794943)
Email; ProtonMail, Tutanota
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by sgjohnson on Saturday September 10, 2022 @06:11PM (#32794966)
ProtonMail is known for completely arbitrarily closing user accounts with 0 recourse.

> Tutanota

Never heard of them.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by shakna on Saturday September 10, 2022 @07:47PM (#32795501)
Tutanota have been around for a bit over a decade. They close unused free accounts after six months inactivity.

Their main focus is end-to-end encrypted email. When sending encrypted emails outside of their ecosystem, they used to send a link to a temporary account, so as to reduce the chance of a leak.

They've never been hugely popular, but their name pops up a fair bit in circles where legality of things might be a bit gray. Like countries where certain human rights are suppressed, or where Tor is needed to workaround only getting government approved sites, etc.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by jacooper on Monday September 12, 2022 @07:38PM (#32818821)
> ProtonMail is known for completely arbitrarily closing user accounts with 0 recourse

Never had an issue with them personally.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by sofixa on Saturday September 10, 2022 @06:07PM (#32794947)
> Google, in my humble opinion, is the single biggest evil in the digital world today.

Palantir? Facebook? Google abuse user data for profit, but at least:

a) their goal is only money

b) they don't leak that data left and right, and don't leave themselves way too easy to be used for inciting genocides

Facebook is by far worse.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by kube-system on Saturday September 10, 2022 @05:46PM (#32794825)
It’s not a contest, but there are plenty of companies that are more evil. Besides companies that are straight up criminal, my vote would go to traditional data brokers. Google might abuse their wealth of data, but at least they won’t happily sell it on the street corner.
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by sgjohnson on Saturday September 10, 2022 @05:56PM (#32794883)
> but at least they won’t happily sell it on the street corner.

what do you imagine targetted advertising is? they will sell everything they know about you to basically anyone willing to pay in the form of "I'd like to target these particular audiences in my ad campaign", and then when you get conversions from that particular campaign, it's not exactly rocket science to dereference the click to a particular individual, provided that there's a conversion.

and if you're a bit more nefarious than that, you don't even need a conversion.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by kube-system on Saturday September 10, 2022 @06:11PM (#32794970)
Yeah, I understand the privacy concerns with targeted advertising, and agree that it is a concern, but it’s once-removed from the type of data you can get from a dedicated data broker. At a data broker you can simply ask for the data you want and they’ll directly provide it.

If Google is a chartered fishing expedition, a data broker is a fish market.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by robertlagrant on Saturday September 10, 2022 @06:16PM (#32794994)
> it's not exactly rocket science to dereference the click to a particular individual

How?

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by fooker on Saturday September 10, 2022 @07:06PM (#32795284)
> vote

It seems like people are doing exactly that, just the results are not to your liking.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by SV_BubbleTime on Sunday September 11, 2022 @02:14AM (#32797254)
Everyone that says “vote” as some action that will definitely all your ailments really just means “I’m an ideologue and you had better join me”.

They don’t actually care about voting participation.

Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by stereoradonc on Saturday September 10, 2022 @07:04PM (#32795273)
I thought these loonies were on Reddit; HN has also seen an influx of them. What has the political affiliations of an individual got to do with a product? The discussion is about Zoho Office Suite. How does the "right-wing" feature in here? Please keep the discussions on course.
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by mms__ on Sunday September 11, 2022 @08:50AM (#32799204)
I for one like to know what I'm supporting when I buy a product or a service.
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by CWuestefeld on Sunday September 11, 2022 @03:50PM (#32802657)
But the argument isn't "this company supports/promotoes/whatever something bad", but rather, "someone important in this company supports something bad", and that's a very different thing.
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by wzy on Saturday September 10, 2022 @06:02PM (#32794909)
Where do I go to vote for them since I have already been a customer of theirs for 10+ years?
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by psuresh on Sunday September 11, 2022 @02:15AM (#32797260)
Lol. The Wire!
Re:Zoho became a $1B company without external investment by aravindet on Saturday September 10, 2022 @08:41PM (#32795820)
This is relevant information. IMO the secondary consequences of buying a product are important to discussions of that product: e.g. effects on the environment, climate, labor conditions, human rights and society.

Closer to this thread: Any discussion of a MyPillow product is incomplete without a mention that part of the purchase price might go into undermining democracy in the US.

The parent's argument seems similar: the founder/owner participates a hindu-supremacist organization known as the RSS, which has been implicated in religious violence; part of what you pay for a Zoho subscription may therefore go into funding these activities.

p.s. perhaps the parent could explain it better: the link is broken for me on Firerox, perhaps use a non-AMP URL?