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Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by k8si on Thursday June 30, 2022 @10:20PM (#31941454)
I imagine this was probably user error on your part. The vegan cheese is usually on the other end of the grocery store from the real cheese, and also usually says 'vegan' prominently, and also there are only like 2-3 brands that make vegan cheese (Miyoko, Daiya, maybe 1 other?). And vegans still usually have to read the ingredients to make sure. Non-vegans could probably do the same if it were that important.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by SllX on Thursday June 30, 2022 @11:05PM (#31941806)
Ah, the “you’re holding it wrong” argument re-contextualized as “you’re just shopping wrong”.

Unfortunately that is not always the case. I don’t know about the parent but I accidentally bought a “Chick’n Burrito” that was right next to the meat burritos. It did not taste like chicken.

Could it have been avoided had I been more careful? Sure! On the other hand vegan dishes taste better than fake meat dishes and I really don’t appreciate the intentionally misleading labeling riding on the good PR of “chicken” and “butter” to try to sell their fakes. Missing a character swap or substitution is not a difficult thing for literate people who are also very tired at the end of the day.

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by k8si on Friday July 01, 2022 @12:53AM (#31942527)
Again, vegans almost always have to read the ingredients/labels, on every processed food product they plan to consume. The little 'vegan' icon on the back is new and not consistently used. Choosing a plant based lifestyle is A LOT more burdensome than not doing that. I know because I've switched back and forth many times and am married to a vegan. Whey, casein, random cream, honey, they're in everything.

Even so: reading ingredients is honestly not that hard.

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by todorus on Friday July 01, 2022 @02:37PM (#31950811)
Again: "you're holding it wrong".

Just because a plant based lifestyle is burdensome, doesn't mean people think it should be. And by that reasoning neither should any other diet. So I don't get why the projection of your experience onto the experience of others is so necessary

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by Klonoar on Thursday June 30, 2022 @11:10PM (#31941849)
...no, in this case you are absolutely shopping wrong. Pay attention to the labels.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by SllX on Thursday June 30, 2022 @11:12PM (#31941864)
Oh believe me, I do especially after that, but that does not justify misleading labeling practices. It’s absolutely intended to be deceptive and ride on the good PR of other products.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by Klonoar on Thursday June 30, 2022 @11:25PM (#31941957)
That's not misleading labeling, and the naming is intended to explain what it's attempting to mimic. Many consumers appreciate that and use it as a signal when shopping.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by cardiffspaceman on Friday July 01, 2022 @12:43PM (#31949101)
If it says, "milk" or "cheese" or "beef" I absolutely should not have to read the label. These things were made by farmers thousands of years ago, and have fairly simple "recipes".

If you want to sell some vegetables or vegetable oil to vegans, I would have thought that vegans would go for it without the unappetizing association with dead, smelly, greasy animal carcasses.

Why does vegan food have to resemble the things that vegans avoid?

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by Klonoar on Friday July 01, 2022 @03:22PM (#31951428)
Even if something is milk, cheese, or beef, do you just... pick it up without looking at what the product is, or where it came from or is sourced from? Read the labels. It is not hard. You exist in a world with other humans who use words across a range of things and it's on you to know what you're buying.

>Why does vegan food have to resemble the things that vegans avoid?

First off: it's not just vegans who buy or are interested in this stuff. People can find it beneficial from a sustainability point of view.

Second, people like the originals! We have rich culinary history with recipes and tastes that people don't necessarily want to give up, but may want a more sustainable/cruelty free/[insert your reason here] alternative.

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by mike00632 on Friday July 01, 2022 @07:16PM (#31954282)
If you're so indiscriminate as a shopper then what does it matter if you eat vegan alternatives? They're better for you, better for the planet and often taste better.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by cheese_goddess on Friday July 01, 2022 @01:48PM (#31950054)
The standard explanation is that those are aimed at ordinary consumers who wish to reduce their meat consumption but can't unless they taste something that tastes like meat (resp. dairy).
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by mike00632 on Friday July 01, 2022 @07:15PM (#31954271)
"chicken" and "butter" have good PR?

The whole point of these lawsuits is to damage vegan alternatives which are growing in popularity.

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by SllX on Sunday July 03, 2022 @06:21PM (#31971505)
Of course butter and chicken have good PR: they’re delicious, nutritious and widely popular. They’re so pervasive in fact that you hardly notice their presence and if you don’t know what someone likes, chances are butter and chicken are a good starting point.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by kelnos on Thursday June 30, 2022 @11:04PM (#31941800)
Ah yes, when something is confusing, blame the user. Classic.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by iforgotpassword on Friday July 01, 2022 @02:43AM (#31943170)
I've never seen anything more confusing then the two words "vegan cheese". Even after consulting with a dozen scientists I couldn't figure out what it's supposed to mean. So I bought it and surprisingly enough, I didn't end up with cheese made from milk as expected, but with cheese that was actually vegan! Could it be me? No, obviously it's somebody else's fault. Like it always is. It's never me.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by ouid on Friday July 01, 2022 @10:18AM (#31946727)
you're assuming what you want to without reading the comments carefully. The "user" was tricked into buying vegan sausages. No one said that they were called vegan sausages.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by iforgotpassword on Saturday July 02, 2022 @02:57AM (#31956848)
It doesn't matter whether we talk about cheese or sausages.

The main point is that when you make laws that make it illegal to call something "vegan cheese" or "vegan steak", you are even more likely to be confronted with those confusing and misleading labels. If anything, the law should be the other way round, require a label that plain and simply says "vegan $product" prominently.

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by stjohnswarts on Friday July 01, 2022 @04:23AM (#31943781)
Why let yourself be a victim though? Just admit you fucked up and don't buy it again. Read the label.
Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by acoard on Friday July 01, 2022 @10:36AM (#31946954)
> The vegan cheese is usually on the other end of the grocery store from the real cheese,

Usually, but not always. I’ve seen them collocated more frequently of late and almost made the same mistake before comparing price. The text was so small I would not have noticed without price setting me off. It clearly can be deceptively packaged and I would imagine many marketing departments will try if they think it’ll make them money.

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by autarch on Thursday June 30, 2022 @11:47PM (#31942108)
> there are only like 2-3 brands that make vegan cheese (Miyoko, Daiya, maybe 1 other?)

Off the top of my head:

Miyoko's, Daiya, Kite Hill, Violife, Forager, Field Roast (Chao), Nuts for Cheese, Dr. Cow, Vtopian, Parmela Creamery

And with a bit of googling:

Moocho (from Tofurky), GoVeggie!, Follow Your Heart (how'd I forget them?), Treeline, So Delicious, Koko Dairy Free, Vitalite, Sheese (hard to find in the US, I think), New Roots, Tofutti (ick), Kinda Co., Cheeze & Thank You, Darë, Catalyst Creamery, Moo No More, RIND, SriMu, Virgin Cheese, Reina Royal Vegan Cuisine

Ok, you get the point.

To be fair, a number of the brands in the second list are niche artisanal products you can only get either directly from the vendor, at niche shops like a vegan cheese shop, or online from a place like Vegan Essentials.

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by NicoJuicy on Saturday July 02, 2022 @06:03PM (#31962865)
Cheese to me is a processed good of milk.

Vegan cheese is not, it shouldn't use cheese in it.

Eg. Gluten free cheese would be processed cheese of milk with a lot extracted out of it. But it would still originate from milk.

Re:France bans veggie ′steaks,′ ′sausages′ to describe veget... by ouid on Friday July 01, 2022 @10:09AM (#31946628)
>The vegan cheese is usually on the other end of the grocery store from the real cheese.

How on earth do you think this is either true or a defense?