News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by memish on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:11PM (#31161420)
"Among the elite, and within Twitter specifically, there is much more inclination to ban the right.

I say this as someone whose political views, if you force them onto the left-right spectrum, probably end up about 80% toward the left. E.g. I've spent millions over the past several elections supporting the Democrats.

It used to be that censorship was something the right did, and free speech was something the left were in favor of. But over the last few decades, banning "problematic" ideas has become a huge component of left culture (http://paulgraham.com/heresy.html).

Plus tech companies in general, and especially Twitter, lean to the left. Imagine walking around Twitter pre-Covid. You'd find plenty of openly far-left employees. How many openly far-right employees would you find? I don't think you'd find any.

The combination of (a) the left's recent focus on banning heretical ideas, (b) the leftward lean of tech companies generally, and (c) the leftward lean of Twitter even among tech companies, means that right-wing speech is much more likely to get banned on Twitter than left.

That's why people on the far right keep starting lame Twitter alternatives. You don't see people on the far left doing that. They don't need to. They have Twitter."

https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1515235822890532864

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by philosopher1234 on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:31PM (#31161651)
I’m pro censorship. We have and need speech norms.

The left and right are not equal. The left does not rely as much on lies to advocate its positions, and the left is not as oriented around destruction and regression as the right.

We need a more robust understanding of speech than “allowed or not”. Emphasis & volume matters.

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by monkeywork on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:42PM (#31161756)
I'm someone on the left and I fundamentally disagree with literally every point you made.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by philosopher1234 on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:43PM (#31161761)
Good for you.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by barbacoa on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:49PM (#31161837)
I'm a firm believer in the horseshoe theory.

If you listen to the intolerant wing of the right, the parts that would legitimately support overturning elections and arresting political opponents, they sound eerily similar to your sentiment.

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by philosopher1234 on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:52PM (#31161859)
The horse shoe theory makes a lot of sense until you actually research the right and left and discover that they are in fact very different.

It’s a thought stopping theory that allows you to remain smug and correct despite being deeply ignorant.

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by bgandrew on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:49PM (#31161826)
those modern lefts.. just look at russia. censorship is how it all started there.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by philosopher1234 on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:52PM (#31161850)
The fact is that humans are not smart enough to reliably detect fact from fiction. Half of this website would just as soon look the other way at trumps track record.

Something needs to be done. Free speech maximalism is a threat.

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by gjsman-1000 on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:40PM (#31161734)
"does not rely as much on lies to advocate its positions"

To be honest, that's hilariously false. The left suppressed Hunter Biden's laptop story for two years, saying it was misinformation, before admitting it was true. The IRS targeted right-wing and Christian non-profit organizations deliberately for auditing. Obama claimed that forcing nuns to buy health insurance covering birth control was necessary, and claimed you could keep your doctor under Obamacare, which even PolitiFact called a Pants-on-Fire Lie. The left claimed that a baker needed to make a personalized cake supporting gay rights, or it would open the waves to discrimination, even though the baker was willing to sell any other cake to them that wasn't customized with that particular label.

I can go on and on.

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by philosopher1234 on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:41PM (#31161746)
Please, do go on and on. You can stop when you get to the left attempting to overturn the American presidential election.

Edit: are our neoliberal overlords a bunch of cold hearted shit heads? Yes. Should we elect and promote barely disguised fascists in response? No.

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by gjsman-1000 on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:50PM (#31161839)
Huh. I remember when the left had Maxine Waters saying to publicly harass voters of the opposite political party, and during the 2016 election when they tried to harass and dox the electors in hope that would prevent Trump from being elected.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by philosopher1234 on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:54PM (#31161870)
Do you remember when the sitting democratic president of the United States claimed to have won the election and attempted to persuade his colleagues to overturn it?

Who the fuck cares about Maxine waters?

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by legalcorrection on Monday April 25, 2022 @07:43PM (#31162303)
They framed Trump for treason and thereby completely undermined him before he even formally took office. Are we going to memoryhole that? That’s the same thing as stealing the election.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by philosopher1234 on Monday April 25, 2022 @08:07PM (#31162479)
One is an indisputable coup attempt and the other is exaggerated.

> it’s not the one you think

Yes it is.

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by bscphil on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:26PM (#31161582)
> That's why people on the far right keep starting lame Twitter alternatives. You don't see people on the far left doing that.

They don't need to because they have cool Twitter alternatives. Like Mastodon.

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by Yoric on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:28PM (#31161613)
Which is also the Trump alternative, iirc. Just the far left seems to respect the license.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by vrfvr on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:32PM (#31161667)
No, it's not THE trump alternative.

It existed before.

Open source, such that anyone can use it

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by Yoric on Tuesday April 26, 2022 @03:21AM (#31164896)
I meant used by the Trump alternative.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by bscphil on Tuesday April 26, 2022 @05:55PM (#31173669)
That's fair, although part of the reason I call Mastodon the "cool" alternative is because of its federation. AFAIK the right wing forks don't generally have that.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by mcphage on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:30PM (#31161633)
Which side is on a book banning tear again?
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by memish on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:35PM (#31161698)
Both! The difference is in what they target.

"On the right, banning books means trying to prevent their kids from reading them. But on the left it often means trying to prevent anyone from reading them." https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1515563419386191880

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by KennyBlanken on Monday April 25, 2022 @07:00PM (#31161935)
The example he cites is from a tweet made by a guild of writers for the Oxford University Press.

> We, the members of the OUP USA Guild, are calling upon our colleagues and authors to take a stand against the upcoming publication of “Gender-Critical Feminism”. Sign the petition below (OUP employees and authors only).

Yeah, that's not a "ban", and "gender critical feminism" = TERFs. Ie, "people who think trans women are faking it so they can rape women and children in bathrooms or 'cheat' 'the system'"

Remind me which side thinks businesses have a constitutional right to refuse to serve people if it violates their "beliefs"...yet finds it unacceptable that unionized workers are objecting to publishing of research on a subject?

Also, remind me which side is boycotting a major entertainment company...because said company's CEO voiced displeasure...at a bill that bans any language referencing non-straight gender orientations?

Re:twitter/the-algorithm by mcphage on Monday April 25, 2022 @08:03PM (#31162461)
That reads like those "UI vs UX" images where the creator just takes 2 random photos and sticks them next to each other—while simultaneously being deeply ignorant of what’s going on in the country right now.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by selectodude on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:44PM (#31161771)
Paul Graham's tweet with zero corroborating evidence other than "believe me I'm paul graham" is not a source.
Re:twitter/the-algorithm by vrfvr on Monday April 25, 2022 @06:31PM (#31161647)
Mastodon is from a far right?