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Re:Zero rupee note (2015) by bradleyjg on Monday March 07, 2022 @06:38AM (#30586584)
> are not the ones making the decision you're objecting to

No one is making this as a decision. Restaurant owners that have tried to put in place a no tipping policy have customers tip anyway because Americans are uncomfortable not tipping. They then think, somewhat accurately, the restaurant has high prices. We are stuck with a bad system.

Re:Zero rupee note (2015) by ethbr0 on Monday March 07, 2022 @08:23AM (#30587404)
It's not a bad system, per se, but is a poorly documented system.

There should be a note on American menus that says "We underpay our staff, so 15-20% tipping is expected." And European menus should read "We compensate our staff sufficiently, so tipping is not expected."

In reality, both of these are never written out, and everyone is expected to learn them culturally. Which ultimately leaves tourists in an awkward spot.

Re:Zero rupee note (2015) by Symbiote on Monday March 07, 2022 @09:14AM (#30588029)
In France, bills usually say "service compris" which means "service included".

In Britain, bills usually say "Service charge" or "Service is included" [1]

But I think these are exceptions, and I wouldn't expect it in general -- just like it doesn't say "Service included" when I buy a buy shoes in France or Britain, even though the staff usually have to fetch them from the stock room.

[1] https://i.inews.co.uk/content/uploads/2019/01/oh.jpg

Re:Zero rupee note (2015) by JshWright on Monday March 07, 2022 @08:49AM (#30587687)
> There should be a note on American menus that says "We underpay our staff, so 15-20% tipping is expected."

I was recently in a restaurant that had exactly that. There was a fine print note at the bottom of the menu explaining that because a state law prevented servers from splitting tips with the kitchen staff, a 3% surcharge would be added to the check so that non-tipped staff could "earn a living wage".

https://www.squidlipsgrill.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Sq...

Re:Zero rupee note (2015) by iudqnolq on Monday March 07, 2022 @08:29AM (#30587468)
Agreed, except that I think it's poorly document and a bad system.

That's why I started this by saying I'd have an issue with someone who kept not tipping after being informed about the issue.

Re:Zero rupee note (2015) by ethbr0 on Monday March 07, 2022 @11:11AM (#30589496)
The bad or not feels arbitrary. It's "different".

But I'd be hard pressed to come up with a reason that "customer -> staff" is objectively better or worse than "customer -> owner -> staff".

Same money, gets to the same place.

Re:Zero rupee note (2015) by bradleyjg on Monday March 07, 2022 @10:05PM (#30595984)
* In reality, both of these are never written out, and everyone is expected to learn them culturally. Which ultimately leaves tourists in an awkward spot.*

It does more than confuse tourists, it locks every restaurant into the system whether the owners wish it or not. That’s why I think the “we underpay” with its pejorative tinge is inappropriate.