People who have been woodworking for decades can own very expensive tools so that they can create very complicated things.

People who are experts in cars can own very expensive cars and tools to tune them.

People who have been working in music can have very expensive instruments and expensive headphones, microphones, sequencers, etc.

We seem to be looking down on experienced "computer experts" and wanting to take their tools away. It's been grinding my gears lately.

I don't think that's the point the commenter was making. The analogous situation would be if someone posted that they made their kitchen table from scratch, and the commenter said that it's great but not everyone has a lathe in their basement, so good that places like Ikea exist as well.

bruh nobody's looking down on people running they're own metal

Server hardware is fun but it's not trivial to manage, buy or run.

So when someone talks about how they've managed servers for 2 decades, own a house where they can install a 42 rack and how much better it is than a hosted solution. A lot of people rightly point out that this is hardly feasible for most people

I started self hosting when I was 12 with whatever last gen hardware at goodwill no one wanted.

People don't need a 42U rack to put a server in their closet though. You buy some surplus server on ebay and throw it on a shelf, no big deal.

It's really not that easy. There's a lot of considerations to make. Which rack size, model you want. Finding someone who will ship that brick to you. Not trivial

Well it is, to get started. If your needs are "mild to moderate", you can buy a brand new intel NUC or a mac mini for <$500 if space is a priority, or go on ebay and buy a beater laptop (I found 5 advertised for <$100 within a minute of searching).

Yes it's trivial. Just go on ebay and buy something. Finding someone? Literally ebay.com. Found.

Also I said _not_ buy a rack, just put it on a shelf.

Got an old laptop laying around?

Not sure why you would need heaps of servers these days given everything is x86 and VM tech is robust and free

GP is upfront about the tradeoffs.

> You pretty much get all the pros and cons of home ownership.

And that's the heart of the matter. Everyone here is arguing in circles based on their feelings about cloud vs their feelings on bare metal (and from what I can tell, pride in their own abilities), but at the end of the day it's a cost-benefit tradeoff. Everyone picks that tradeoff for themselves. As my immigrant parents are getting older, I'm thinking of getting them a business internet line and a SIP phone in their house so that if they need me in an emergency (health or otherwise) they can reach me quickly/reliably. It's something I'm weighing based on the cost of the service/infrastructure/maintenance against my parents' technical and social capabilities (which are limited as older immigrants from a non-Western country.)

It's all about tradeoffs. As computing professionals we have the knowledge and the skills to uniquely take advantage of these tradeoffs in our personal lives. Much like I know quite a few cabinetmakers who do actually make furniture for their house with their skills, their tools, and the shop they work in. That doesn't stop most people from buying furniture from Ikea or most businesses from using cloud hosting.

You don't need a 42u rack. You can run a cluster of Raspberry Pi's hidden in your basement ceiling rafters like me.

Short throw from that to this classic:

> <erno> hm. I've lost a machine.. literally _lost_. it responds to ping, it works completely, I just can't figure out where in my apartment it is.

http://www.bash.org/?5273

Ha. Classic.

Racks are not that expensive, and are a very good way to keep things connected, powered, accessible and tidy.

Heaps of Pis in rafters will quickly turn into a cable spaghetti hell tied into ugly knots.

I agree, when you get to a larger scale. 3-5 RPi's won't make to much spaghetti.

Even for that I'd get a 8-12U box and connect everything using cable organizers and a patch panel.

What makes you think cable management for a bunch of Raspberry Pi's is any more difficult than cable management for a large rack?

Sounds like a new category of specialist rack is needed.

Introducing the... "RafterRack™" ;)

what if you live in van, studio or apartment? You can't just fit a rack anywhere

They never suggested otherwise. They simply shared their current setup.

And a tolerant wife/spouse.

My closet of RPi's are quiet.

yes

I can do the same thing with the 15x8x20cm Synology sitting above my bathroom (don’t ask, that’s where the internet enters te house :P).

Your main point still stands though, not everyone can or wants to do that.