News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by Nextgrid on Tuesday November 30, 2021 @08:58AM (#29392115)
From my experience there are 2 kinds of recruiters.

Those most likely operating out of the same boiler rooms as tech support scammers who have pitch terrible roles and employ a spray & pray approach where it's just a spam campaign with very little effort on their side. Those are a waste of time, the roles are terrible and are pretty much never matched to your profile, and when you go through anyway the recruiter will not provide any value (I had one insist on me writing a short resume of my profile... I mean you have my resume in front of you, why don't you do it?).

The rest which are typically alright. Again, quality varies, but I haven't had any outright "bad" experiences with any of this category. On the top-end of this category are those that understand the industry very well and what you're looking for and will only pitch you the right roles at the right time. The right recruiters can essentially be your sales team and are absolutely worth having on your side.

I suspect most people's interactions here would be exclusively those from the first category as they're the ones that typically send unsolicited spam. The second category will typically show much more restraint in reaching out out of the blue, so unless you explicitly seek them out you may not even be aware they exist.

Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by Taylor_OD on Tuesday November 30, 2021 @10:42AM (#29393325)
The real two types of recruiters are experienced and inexperienced. Most recruiters have not made a successful placement. It's a sales job and many recruiting firms hire entry level. These are also the recruiters who send the most inmail spam because their "training" is learning on the job. The chances of interacting with a junior third party recruiter is very high.

A very small percentage of third party recruiters stay third party once they have a year or two of experience. If they are any good but don't love sales they go internal (recruiter for an actual company - less pay but far far less stress).

A tiny percentage of recruiters stay as third party recruiters and are actually good. They often built networks from their early inmail spam days when they did get lucky and place someone so they don't send as many inmails now.

You are almost always dealing with near entry level third party recruiters who are learning on the job. That is in large part why dealing with recruiters on average sucks.

This is never going to change but if you are looking for a new job or you are interested in a role a recruiter reaches out to you about you can absolutely ask to speak to a lead or a manager of their team instead of them.

"Hey I know the third party recruiting industry is tough. I am very interested in this position. Do you have a lead or a manager who I can speak with to learn more about this position and how to prepare for the interview?" That is how you get to the person who actually knows what they are doing. The immediate recruiter might make a stink but their manager likely wont. If you are actually a good fit for the job your chances of landing there do go up if they spend time to speak with you and help you prepare. They only get paid if you actually start there.

Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by rurp on Tuesday November 30, 2021 @10:55AM (#29393482)
Can you share a bit about how to find the second type of recruiter? I've gotten a sense of the dynamic you're describing but have no real idea of how to find good recruiters. As you say, pretty much all of the inbound messages I get are very spammy.
Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by Nextgrid on Tuesday November 30, 2021 @11:25AM (#29393848)
That's a very good question I don't think I have a straightforward answer to. I built my network over time by using LinkedIn suggestions - the more recruiters you connect with the more it will recommend, and now I occasionally get new connection requests from recruiters which I approve if they're relevant to my industry/skills and aren't from the first category.

I guess I would just throw a few names out there and let you build from there. Disclaimer: I haven't worked with them enough to say they are truly exceptional, but at least they're not from the first category and actually have decent roles:

* La Fosse Associates

* Opus Recruitment Solutions

* Austin Fraser

* Gathered and Found (never heard of this one but got recommended it by someone just now)

Connect with a few people from each, have a few calls and go from there.

Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by Serverless_joe on Tuesday November 30, 2021 @01:13PM (#29395409)
Former 3rd party recruiter here, I loved meeting with candidates and hearing about what matters most to them before "pitching" them any opportunities. A good recruiter should learn more about who you are and your career goals before making any suggestions. I would say that is a good benchmark of a recruiter who cares and is not going to try and put a square peg in a round hole, so to speak...

*While I have met some downright bad recruiters in my time, I have also met some really great ones, so if anyone wants a connection to one LMK!

Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by HeyLaughingBoy on Wednesday December 01, 2021 @01:08PM (#29407038)
Echoes my comment above. The guys I met from Aerotech took their time over a long lunch meeting to get to know me and what I valued in a company and where I wanted my career to go before looking for opportunities.

That said, I feel that recruiters work harder the farther along you are in your career. They make more as a percentage and they realized that experienced candidates likely have a larger network and will send them more referrals. It's a sales business, they're not stupid.

Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by Serverless_joe on Tuesday December 07, 2021 @12:51PM (#29475808)
100%! Look for recruiters with longer tenure, bad sales people don't stick around...
Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by HeyLaughingBoy on Wednesday December 01, 2021 @01:05PM (#29407011)
I'll add Aerotech to that list. They were friendly, took the time to get to know me, including taking me to lunch at a pretty nice place. And really worked to focus on the type of work I wanted to do. Would definitely engage again.
Re:Ask HN: Are Indeed, LinkedIn the go-to places for explori... by 908B64B197 on Tuesday November 30, 2021 @02:42PM (#29396510)
Look at who was in charge of recruiting at the VC backed companies your friends joined.