This is completely arbitrary. We could switch to DST all year round and work 9-5, or we could switch to normal time year-round, and work 8-4. It's the same thing - you're just calling it something different.

You're right and this is the single dumbest argument I see all the time for why we need the clock switch.

It's far easier to change the local office hours for workplaces and schools during winter time as needed. For extreme northern areas, they could even move it by more than one hour. It can be their choice! Let the work hours be decided locally rather than a blanket rule for the poles and equator. Match our behavior to the daylight rather than the other way round - you know, like every other species on Earth

Public transport schedules need to be adjusted, too, and local networks often tie into regional networks, which in turn tie into the national network (where such a thing exists). Each municipality choosing its own date for switching could cause a lot of complications in that regard.

let's end the fall back, and stay on DST. It's the time change that is stupid. It's more about when we want the light for our schedules.

That’s what Utah plans to do but there is currently a federal law that prohibits the use of permanent DST. Utah, California, and a couple other states have asked the federal government to change that law and I believe there are plans to consider it soon.

Utah has passed a law that makes DST permanent as soon as the federal law is removed.

Edit: On further review, this seems to have died in committee.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-bill/6331...

Florida passed theirs. Other states too but I don't recall which.

This is the worst option. Since we started caring about time, "noon" has meant "when the sun is straight overhead". Unless there's a parallel push to change noon to 1PM (and midnight to 1AM), I'd fight that tooth and nail.

Correct me if I'm wrong but actual "high noon" and 12pm don't currently line up except for a couple days a year, do they?

Sure, but not by a huge amount, and less than an hour.

Time zones themselves mean that "solar noon" is rounded anyway, but they at least try to roughly go along with it.

Is shifting your schedule by an hour and leaving work at 4PM not a valid solution?

Most people have very little control over their schedule.

This- Even if your work allows you to set your own schedule, there many other aspects of society that don't. Schools and daycares, in particular, can dictate the schedule of parents. If you can't start off to work because the bus/dropoff isn't till 830a it doesn't matter when your office lets you come in.

Even if there aren't external factors and there is theoretically flexibility around working hours cultural norms can make it difficult. My workgroup/division seems to have a strong norm about not scheduling meetings before 930a, but scheduling from 4-5p is normal.

If legislature can change the fricking clock they can decree working hours are shifted as a one-off.

Clocks don't fund elections.

How about putting the energy of fighting for DST into fighting for a better schedule instead?

One likely has a chance at actually happening. No way are teachers changing their schedule for other people.

> No way are teachers changing their schedule for other people.

Not even for the endless studies that show benefits from matching school start times to what's best for kids.

ref: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=study+school+start+times+sleep

I doubt they have the option really. It's a catch 22. Schools start early so people can go to work.

It turns out that schools can indeed move start times. All it takes is a bus driver shortage - and lots of hand-wringing.

https://www.tampabay.com/news/education/2021/11/01/pasco-fre...

It's reasonable argument against late elementary start times but not later high school start times.

High school students are shown to have the greatest need of later sleep times while being the least in need of constant adult supervision.

Yet, they are forced up earliest.

Agreed!

Work from home.