News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by gbronner on Friday October 29, 2021 @10:39AM (#29038978)
The goal is to get the students out of their bedrooms. There's plenty of common space, and lots of really nice places to go study and socialize out of your bedroom. This is intended to promote real-life socialization, which is the only real reason to go to in-person college these days.

Plus, everyone gets a single!

My college roommates had blackout curtains on the small windows in our rooms. Not sure how this is different.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by wpietri on Friday October 29, 2021 @10:54AM (#29039197)
Sure, we get the goal. It could even be an interesting experiment. Maybe some people would like it. Maybe lots of people. Or maybe it causes lasting psychological harm. But this is going to get built and used for decades regardless of the results of the experiment.

> My college roommates had blackout curtains on the small windows in our rooms. Not sure how this is different.

You and your college roommates had a choice. Did everybody in your dorm do that?

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by thehappypm on Friday October 29, 2021 @01:16PM (#29041044)
If you want to talk about "choice", this is not the hill that matters. So many colleges force their students to live on campus, and then squeeze them into forced doubles or even triples in conditions far worse than what's being built here.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by wpietri on Monday November 01, 2021 @09:53AM (#29066635)
Whether this is worse is exactly what's at question here. You can't just assume the answer.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by dymax78 on Friday October 29, 2021 @11:51AM (#29039954)
> My college roommates had blackout curtains on the small windows in our rooms. Not sure how this is different.

I'm extremely confused. Were your blackout curtains made of sheet metal and welded to the walls?

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by lbriner on Friday October 29, 2021 @11:26AM (#29039593)
Which is great except 50% of people are introverts and need space to recharge. How many people live like this in real life? That speaks to the choice of hanging out followed by "leave me alone".

It sounds like an experiment but it could probably have been done slightly further "away from home" if it was about collaboration. Just have places to encourage people to hang out if they want to and not if they don't. Forcing them just feels like mental breakdown waiting-to-happen.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by gbronner on Friday October 29, 2021 @12:17PM (#29040278)
Living like this is actually pretty common both at universities and as a young adult. You have private space, a shared kitchen/dining room, and the building has lounges and other public amenities.

Your room is for sleep, and possibly study, though there are other places on campus with fewer distractions. You can choose to eat and work together in groups in your dining room. You socialize away from your suite so you don't annoy your roommates.

The dorms that I used had all sorts of unpleasant features:

-- giant shared bathrooms had gang showers, or required you go go down 2 flights of stairs and along a hallway for 100 yards -- shared larger rooms with multiple beds and desks, creating issues around differing schedules -- no kitchens or cooking facilities -- no food storage facilities, creating unsanitary conditions

etc.

As an example, a fairly common layout that I've seen is a 3-room quad -- two very small rooms with two bunk beds, two dressers and maybe a close adjoining a not particularly large 'common' room with 4 desks, perhaps a mini-fridge, and a beat-up couch.

Munger's vision is a palace compared to this.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by dave5104 on Friday October 29, 2021 @12:48PM (#29040711)
> The dorms that I used had all sorts of unpleasant features

Just because you had a poor dorm experience doesn't mean a brand new dorm built in 2021 needs to replicate that experience.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by bobthechef on Friday October 29, 2021 @12:15PM (#29040257)
I detest architectural coercion. Who is this old rich fuck to force "socialization" (a dystopian word if there ever was one)? That's my business. Buildings and urban environments should be built to allow various degrees of social interaction based on one's own personal needs and determinations as you see fit, not some megalomaniacal lunatic's tyrannical and dehumanizing designs. This is the tyrannical streak running through modernist architecture. For some reason, some people with money see everyone else as rats or cattle that they can heard around as they please, for their "own good".

In an environment that respects human persons and their individuality as well as their social nature, the environment is structured according to subsidiarian principles. The town square is where anyone can socialize with anyone in town. Next the building courtyard is where anyone in the building can socialize with anyone else in the building. Next, the living room or common area of an apartment is where anyone can socialize with anyone in the apartment (analogously for single family homes). Individual bedrooms are for total privacy. I don't need to be coerced out of my bedroom if that's where I need to be because some crazy billionaire high on his own flatulence says so.

Be very wary of so-called "philanthropists". They are in love with their power to control and coerce, not the actual good.

To quote C. S. Lewis:

"My contention is that good men (not bad men) consistently acting upon that position [imposing “the good”] would act as cruelly and unjustly as the greatest tyrants. They might in some respects act even worse. Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under of robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber barons cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some points be satiated; but those who torment us for their own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to heaven yet at the same time likely to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be “cured” against one’s will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on the level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals."

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by thehappypm on Friday October 29, 2021 @01:17PM (#29041052)
Sir, this is a Wendy's
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by ethbr0 on Friday October 29, 2021 @11:51AM (#29039967)
Or, you force socialization on a population that's increasingly turning inward, to the detriment of society in general.

It's hubris that on one hand HN can bitch about how egomaniacal companies like Facebook and Google are, and yet on the other complain about how architecture designed to promote socialization is unfair.

Where do we think those social-deaf, micro-optimizing engineers come from?

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by krisoft on Friday October 29, 2021 @02:43PM (#29042129)
> Or, you force socialization on a population that's increasingly turning inward, to the detriment of society in general.

College kids living in dorms are turning inward? Do you have proof of that or that is just a hunch?

> ... yet on the other complain about how architecture designed to promote socialization is unfair.

The goal of making architecture promote socialisation is great. The complaint is not about the aim. The complaint is about how it is achieved.

Bedrooms with no natural light or natural air circulation suck. We don't build houses like this because it is not a good idea. Saying that your aim was to promote socialisation doesn't change that.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by ghaff on Friday October 29, 2021 @12:05PM (#29040141)
Among other things, architectural design makes decisions about how space is allocated and how it will probably be used. Of course, architects get things wrong. The dorm I lived in undergraduate did a fair bit well--and also had some common space that was sort of out of the way and was hardly ever used.

But one way or another, an architect is going to design things in a way that (they think) optimizes for certain behaviors and use whether that's socializing/collaborating or the maximum privacy/anonymity.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by celtain on Friday October 29, 2021 @12:57PM (#29040821)
>Which is great except 50% of people are introverts and need space to recharge. How many people live like this in real life?

The vast majority of students? I don't think I knew a single person who lived without roommates when I was a university student. Freshman year nearly everybody shared a room with 1-2 other people, this new dorm would provide far more privacy than that.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by pseudalopex on Friday October 29, 2021 @10:53AM (#29039169)
Your roommates chose to have blackout curtains. And they could choose to open them.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by adolph on Friday October 29, 2021 @11:09AM (#29039384)
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by bobthepanda on Friday October 29, 2021 @11:27AM (#29039614)
Ah yes, let‘s make the students paying out the butt pay for an expensive lamp in a room that barely fits in said room.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by suzzer99 on Friday October 29, 2021 @11:27AM (#29039610)
Apropos name.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by alistairSH on Friday October 29, 2021 @10:46AM (#29039098)
The goal is to get the students out of their bedrooms. There's plenty of common space, and lots of really nice places to go study and socialize out of your bedroom. This is intended to promote real-life socialization, which is the only real reason to go to in-person college these days.

But there's zero evidence this building will actually accomplish this. And, according to the architect who resigned, plenty of evidence to the contrary.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by k8si on Friday October 29, 2021 @10:46AM (#29039100)
Introvert's nightmare. Also, who can study in a common area with all the noise?
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by klyrs on Friday October 29, 2021 @12:27PM (#29040401)
Goal: socialization.

Achievement: kids lying on their beds doomscrolling because the common space in the room is dominated by a massive table with exactly enough room for everybody to bump elbows.

Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by thehappypm on Friday October 29, 2021 @01:17PM (#29041059)
I would imagine an introvert would do far worse in a shared triple room with no common areas at all, in this dorm, they have a private room.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by dEnigma on Friday October 29, 2021 @02:21PM (#29041865)
Why is the alternative automatically a triple room with no common area, and not simply a single room with at least a window (plus a common area)?
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by thehappypm on Friday October 29, 2021 @04:04PM (#29042957)
Because that's what this proposal is replacing.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by dEnigma on Friday October 29, 2021 @04:08PM (#29042997)
But the real alternative is another (better) proposal, not keeping things as they are.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by thehappypm on Monday November 01, 2021 @09:56AM (#29066656)
Sure, but the school can't justify spending triple per student than standard dorms cost. Even with the gift, the school needs to be financially responsible, and making a huge leap in quality of life would seem financially irresponsible when thousands of other colleges squeeze kids into forced doubles and triples. This is a step towards giving students both privacy and spaces to socialize, with some drawbacks that are a consequence of not having infinite funding.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by colinmhayes on Friday October 29, 2021 @01:40PM (#29041352)
This is why the library exists.
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by dihydro on Friday October 29, 2021 @11:04AM (#29039322)
I could assume that they would have those amenities also, but we have no way of knowing, and isn't that a concern in and of itself? In the article linked below, the artist renderings look more like an open concept market place like a mall or Boston Public Market. Fine spaces to eat, shop, and socialize, but not so good for study. https://www.news.ucsb.edu/2021/020361/absolutely-stunning
Re:Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm by bobthechef on Friday October 29, 2021 @11:57AM (#29040036)
Your college roommates had the option to black out their windows. People in this dorm won't have the option to open the curtains. That's the difference.