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Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by neximo64 on Saturday October 23, 2021 @06:43AM (#28967226)
So basically the others not yourself. Ireland, Malta, Cyprus.. nah.

I recall not so long ago a prominent European bank's branch in Lithuania making headlines for very explicitly laundering cash.

Then there's the whole ex dividend fiasco. There's a couple of frauds with Steinhoff, Wirecard... I mean seriously all you got to look is a bit deeper..

More likely this is a political stunt either against the UK or for the banking union as one of the things it can solve for (a common anti fraud system, etc)

[1] https://www.lrt.lt/en/news-in-english/19/1240097/lithuania-c...

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by belter on Saturday October 23, 2021 @06:49AM (#28967253)
You missed the one where the magic really happens...

"The Netherlands is still one of the world's main tax havens, coming in fourth place on Tax Justice Network's biennial ranking of tax havens. Only the British Virgin Islands, the Cayman Islands and Bermuda scored worse than the Netherlands when it came to tax avoidance."

https://nltimes.nl/2021/03/09/netherlands-worlds-4th-biggest...

"Bermuda? Guess again. Turns out Holland is the tax haven of choice for US companies"

https://thecorrespondent.com/6942/bermuda-guess-again-turns-...

"The Coronavirus exposes the Netherlands as a tax haven – again"

https://www.euractiv.com/section/economic-governance/opinion...

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by Aeolun on Saturday October 23, 2021 @07:14AM (#28967377)
But how? Living in the Netherlands I want me some of that magic. My taxes are through the roof (both as a company and personally).
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by CodeGlitch on Saturday October 23, 2021 @07:28AM (#28967439)
You have to be wealthy to access this special tax break :)
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by Arnt on Saturday October 23, 2021 @08:34AM (#28967815)
Being wealthy doesn't help. You have to be outside the Netherlands and have your income outside the Netherlands.
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by refurb on Saturday October 23, 2021 @08:56AM (#28967952)
Exactly. The tax haven aspect is mostly the level of transparency with other countries. If you're from a non-Western country (because there is data sharing among EU and US/Canada to some extent) have $10M and decide to invest it in the Netherlands or another tax haven, it's pretty unlikely the Netherlands is going to be all that helpful in sharing that relevant information with your home country so they can actually collect taxes.

If you're actually a legal resident of the Netherlands well that doesn't help you at all since the Netherlands gov't has complete visibility into financial transactions within the country.

Same with the US. Great place to hide money if you're from certain countries since Uncle Sam doesn't give two shits if some countries can't collect taxes.

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by belter on Saturday October 23, 2021 @08:09AM (#28967657)
Now you go to the crux of it, and how devilish this all is for the Dutch citizens. :-) You see, to note how intellectually dishonest the authorities that implement this system are, your argument, that the taxes rates in the Netherlands are not that low ... Was what the Dutch Economy minister used, when the Obama administration labeled the Netherlands a tax haven back in 2009 already.

For the citizen, it is indeed, a country with one of the biggest individual Total Tax loads in the world. You get a flurry of them and its not really progressive. You are basically paying into one of three tax brackets and the top rate of 49.5 percent comes very quickly for anything above to €68,507 ( aprox 80,000 USD )

The current world top countries by income tax brackets are:

Ivory Coast 60% Finland 56.95% Japan 55.97% Denmark 55.9% Austria 55% Sweden 52.9% Aruba 52% Belgium 50% Israel 50% Slovenia 50% Netherlands 49.5%

As I do not believe anybody in the Ivory Coast is paying those tax brackets...and as Aruba is part of the Kingdom of the Netherlands :-) you are definitely in the top ten but that is only half of the story. After you go through all of these:

Income tax (inkomstenbelasting)

Payroll tax (loonheffing)

VAT sales tax (BTW / omzetbelasting)

Import tax (douane)

Motor vehicle tax (motorrijtuigbelasting)

Inheritance tax (erfbelasting)

Gift tax (schenkbelasting)

Transfer tax (overdrachtsbelasting)

Most towns even have a Dog tax! ( but funnily enough...not a Cat tax...)

https://www.denhaag.nl/en/taxes/dog-tax.htm

"... It makes no difference if the dog is big or small..." , what means they actually thought about it.

Believe it or not, there is even an Exit Tax if you decide to say its too much, and you want to leave the country with your assets. You then get all of the local ones:

property tax

waste collection charges

street cleaning/maintenance

sewerage tax

movable property tax (e.g., houseboats, portable kiosks)

The system is organized for the corporations, and special tax structures organized by the big four, and other organizations close to to the Dutch political system.

"...There is no revolving door policy for departing Dutch civil servants. Employees are free to take up any new position once they've served their notice period..."

Old sample example: https://corporateeurope.org/en/revolvingdoorwatch/cases/niko...

Its particularly for Foundations and the rich who can afford it, like for example the Ikea foundation based in the Netherlands:

"IKEA’s Flat-Pack Tax Scheme: a Corporate Structure Designed to Facilitate Profit-shifting and Tax Avoidance"

https://medium.com/@jurgeng/ikeas-tax-scheme-a-corporate-str...

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by Silhouette on Saturday October 23, 2021 @09:36AM (#28968283)
The current world top countries by income tax brackets are:

Ivory Coast 60% Finland 56.95% Japan 55.97% Denmark 55.9% Austria 55% Sweden 52.9% Aruba 52% Belgium 50% Israel 50% Slovenia 50% Netherlands 49.5%

It doesn't help that tax systems are so complicated that it can be almost impossible to make meaningful like-for-like comparisons in discussions like this.

For example, the UK isn't listed there, yet in reality the way our system works creates brackets where some people do have an effective marginal income tax rate over 60%. Worse, the system isn't entirely progressive, because those brackets don't coincide with the final marginal rate of income tax for those with the highest incomes.

Rather like the Dutch, for those of us living in the UK and those of us operating small businesses here, who are paying the full intended tax rates, it's frustrating to see the games played by the huge multinationals and UHNW individuals that are clearly forms of tax avoidance, and to see the UK labelled as a tax haven. I doubt anyone living near me feels like they're benefitting from an unusually low-tax economy right now!

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by belter on Saturday October 23, 2021 @10:38AM (#28968936)
As FYI...I normally get my stats from here: https://tradingeconomics.com/indicators

Disclaimer: Not associated with the site in any way.

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by OnlyMortal on Saturday October 23, 2021 @08:02AM (#28967611)
30% ruling (was 35%) is a good place to start.

Running your own BV was always stupidly expensive.

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by lbreakjai on Saturday October 23, 2021 @08:48AM (#28967907)
That's not exactly the same thing is it? That's a tax break granted to individuals if they're highly qualified and recruited from abroad to come live and work in the Netherlands.

I doubt this is what people are talking about when they say the Netherlands is a tax heaven. Italy and Spain have similar schemes.

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by odiroot on Saturday October 23, 2021 @07:55AM (#28967578)
Oh, don't you worry. Average person's labour being taxed highly is not considered a problem. It's rather a solution to many problems.
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by Y-bar on Saturday October 23, 2021 @07:20AM (#28967403)
> So basically the others not yourself. Ireland [...]

The EU Commission took Ireland to court (and lost) about their secret sweetheart tax deals with Apple so it appears they are well aware of what happens within their own borders.

https://curia.europa.eu/jcms/upload/docs/application/pdf/202...

> By its decision, the Commission considered that the tax rulings in question constituted State aid unlawfully put into effect by Ireland. The aid was declared incompatible with the internal market. The Commission demanded the recovery of the aid in question. According to the Commission’s calculations, Ireland had granted Apple 13 billion euro in unlawful tax advantages.

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by throwawaylinux on Saturday October 23, 2021 @07:43AM (#28967519)
> The EU Commission took Ireland to court (and lost) about their secret sweetheart tax deals with Apple

So the EU court found the EU member did nothing wrong.

> so it appears they are well aware of what happens within their own borders.

I don't think the parent was complaining that the EU did not know what goes on within their borders.

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by Y-bar on Saturday October 23, 2021 @08:20AM (#28967717)
Perhaps so, I read it more along the lines of "EU discovered they did not do enough" because the ruling did have an effect; the EU Parliament went ahead with Article 116 against not just Ireland but also Netherlands and Belgium. So they _do_ target and attempt to improve the internal market.
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by throwawaylinux on Saturday October 23, 2021 @08:27AM (#28967764)
Look at the comment you first replied to though. What are you actually arguing? That US or UK don't understand what goes on, or that you can't find anecdotal instances of them attempting to improve their regulation?
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by Y-bar on Saturday October 23, 2021 @09:08AM (#28968032)
OP in this thread is basically saying that EU should not point fingers toward other nations when they have enough clean-up to do at home. I am arguing that EU, while flawed in its execution of that duty, is actively doing just that. What exactly do you think I am saying?
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by throwawaylinux on Saturday October 23, 2021 @09:46AM (#28968399)
I think you're exactly implying that this lone anecdote constitutes a good measure by which the EU is "doing more" than the UK or the USA and therefore would not be hypocritical by pointing the finger.
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by Y-bar on Saturday October 23, 2021 @10:08AM (#28968670)
Why do you bring forth this straw man argument?
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by throwawaylinux on Saturday October 23, 2021 @10:17AM (#28968755)
If that's not what you are implying then what was the point of the comment in the first place?
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by Y-bar on Sunday October 24, 2021 @03:20PM (#28981030)
To give a partial retort of OP:s assertion.
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by throwawaylinux on Monday October 25, 2021 @08:56PM (#28995174)
It isn't even a partial retort because no part of the OP's point relies on there being no instances of attempts to improve things. And even if it did then you could take counter-examples for the UK and USA as well.
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by rusk on Saturday October 23, 2021 @06:45AM (#28967235)
Don’t forget Luxembourg, Monaco …

EDIT the Netherlands is another one that flies under the radar quite well - Lichtenstein I believe has an up and coming financial services industry too

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by pvitz on Saturday October 23, 2021 @07:04AM (#28967329)
Liechtenstein and Monaco are not members of the EU.
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by rusk on Saturday October 23, 2021 @07:37AM (#28967489)
> Liechtenstein and Monaco are not members of the EU

come off it. They're very much jacked into the EU economy.

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by tomohawk on Saturday October 23, 2021 @07:17AM (#28967388)
But they make the policies of the EU possible.

How may EU citizens, especially EU elites, hide there money in those places?

Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by bsd44 on Saturday October 23, 2021 @10:49AM (#28969048)
City of London Corporation, Gibraltar, Jersey, British Virgin Islands, South Dakota... I'm intentionally ignoring honeypots such as Cayman Islands, Delaware, Panama etc.
Re:European Parliament: UK and US are global hubs for money ... by throw63738 on Saturday October 23, 2021 @06:45AM (#28967238)
Those countries are not really tax heavens anymore. Especially Ireland changed a lot!