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Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by nixpulvis on Friday October 22, 2021 @07:57AM (#28956158)
Hmmmm... I was under the impression this was already the case. I remember reading about this a while ago when I was learning that they can force you to provide a fingerprint or face-scan.
Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by ceejayoz on Friday October 22, 2021 @08:03AM (#28956207)
Not having to reveal the passcode has been the rule for a while.

Not being allowed to bring that refusal up as evidence of guilt on Fifth Amendment grounds during the trial is new. (And correct.)

Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by dragonwriter on Friday October 22, 2021 @10:14AM (#28957428)
> Not having to reveal the passcode has been the rule for a while

No, its not. It is an issue that is left open in US Supreme Court Fifth Amendment case law, and on which lower courts are split.

> Not being allowed to bring that refusal up as evidence of guilt on Fifth Amendment grounds during the trial is new

No, it is well-established that you can't raise use of Fifth Amendment self-incrimination rights to suggest guilt, so if not revealing passcodes is protected (which is the point in dispute that EFF is arguing to the Utah Supreme Court, and which the court immediately below agreed with), there is no dispute that refusal can't also be used to suggest guilt.

Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by ceejayoz on Friday October 22, 2021 @10:18AM (#28957496)
You can't say the first is left open but the second is not.

If "can I be forced to reveal the passcode" is undecided, "can refusing to do so imply guilt" depends on the resolution of the first.

Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by dragonwriter on Friday October 22, 2021 @10:21AM (#28957533)
> You can't say the first is left open but the second is not.

I didn't. I said, in summary, that the first is left open, but that the first necessarily implies the second is not.

Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by Cthulhu_ on Friday October 22, 2021 @08:37AM (#28956491)
Which is messed up. That said, biometric unlock is identification, NOT authorization; if you have secrets on your phone, do not use biometrics. They are a low to medium security convenience.

Second, of course, don't keep evidence of crimes on your phone.

And final tip, on an iphone, hitting the lock button on the side five times rapidly will disable the biometric unlock until the passcode has been filled in. It also pops up with the option to call emergency services. Spamming the lock button is considered a panic button.

Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by tzs on Friday October 22, 2021 @09:02AM (#28956712)
> And final tip, on an iphone, hitting the lock button on the side five times rapidly will disable the biometric unlock until the passcode has been filled in. It also pops up with the option to call emergency services. Spamming the lock button is considered a panic button.

This may vary from iPhone model to iPhone model, but you can also disable biometric unlock by holding down both the lock button and one of the volume buttons for several seconds. This approach is more discrete.

The "spam the lock button" starts the emergency call countdown, which is accompanied by a loud alarm.

The "hold lock and volume" method brings up the screen with the "slide to power off" button, the "medical ID" button, and the "emergency call" button, but does not immediately start the emergency call countdown. If you keep holding lock and volume it will start the emergency call countdown with a 5 second countdown and without an alarm.

Edit: Here is Apple's documentation on this [1]. Some of this is configurable in the "Emergency SOS" settings.

[1] https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/make-emergency-calls-...

Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by rabuse on Friday October 22, 2021 @10:02AM (#28957288)
Thank you for this. Didn't know the lock and volume trick.
Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by tzs on Friday October 22, 2021 @09:18AM (#28956841)
> Second, of course, don't keep evidence of crimes on your phone.

Also, if you have accomplices in your crimes make sure they don't keep evidence of your involvement on their phones.

The Fifth Amendment covers self-incrimination. It doesn't cover incrimination against others.

A prosecutor can grant one of your accomplices immunity to prosecution based on any evidence found on their phone about their crimes, and then it is fine under the Fifth Amendment to force them to unlock their phone and then use any evidence of your crimes found on their phone against you.

Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by cat199 on Friday October 22, 2021 @08:51AM (#28956613)
> identification, NOT authorization

if a user can't decouple the two and control them as distinct mechanisms, the user interaction serves as both and this distinction is irrelevant

apologies but bringing this particular distinction up when has no bearing on the discussion is a pet peeve of mine

Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by kibwen on Friday October 22, 2021 @09:32AM (#28956974)
On Android, rebooting the phone will disable biometric login until the passcode is re-entered.
Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by 8bitbuddhist on Friday October 22, 2021 @10:03AM (#28957306)
You can do the same by pressing and holding the power button on the lock screen to pull up a menu, then press Lockdown. I'm not sure if it's enabled by default, but it is a security option on at least Android 11+.
Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by NoGravitas on Friday October 22, 2021 @11:30AM (#28958479)
At least 10+, and I think it may have been introduced in 9 if I remember past upgrades correctly. I don't think it's something enabled by default, but it is available to turn on in the default security settings page.
Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by dylan604 on Friday October 22, 2021 @11:17AM (#28958297)
Kind of hard to do that in front of the coppers though, especially if they have already taken it from you.
Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by devmor on Friday October 22, 2021 @11:06AM (#28958183)
Same on iOS and iPadOS. Power cycling requires the passcode.
Re:Police can’t demand you reveal your phone passcode then t... by devmor on Friday October 22, 2021 @11:05AM (#28958166)
>on an iphone, hitting the lock button on the side five times rapidly will disable the biometric unlock until the passcode has been filled in.

I don't know what iPhone you have, but on mine, that brings up Apple Pay.