News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
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Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by foolinaround on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @12:27PM (#28695984)
Can one agree that black lives matter, without needing to support the tactics of the 'Black Lives Matter' organization?

Still a white supremacist?

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Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by dang on Friday October 01, 2021 @05:12AM (#28716214)
The two of you broke the site guidelines egregiously with this flamewar. We ban accounts that do that, so no more of this, please—it's not what HN is for and it destroys what it is for.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by balancemayvary on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @01:18PM (#28696813)
Lol, mask off. I don't debate bad-faith actors, and that's all this reply is; sensationalist and fantastical; not rooted in the reality.

"Burning down cities"; a few buildings across seperate incidents. Reporting focused entirely on senstationalizing that, and ignored the very real, very NEEDED progress made by the remainder of the protests.

Just pre-empptively (because I won't be further replying to this sub-sub-thread): It's well documented that inciting of violence is OFTEN done by undercover cops, well-to-do-white-supremacist-home-owners-using-spray-paint-for-the-first-time and neo-nazis.

Edit: One more thing I can't let slide: Families can organize traditionally. Some don't get the privelege to choose; violence campaigns of austerity ripped apart their neighborhoods. Others self-determine that the traditional family structure doesn't suit them. Autonomy means we should be able to choose...

...either way, the forced assumption that "BLM is anti-family" is...WOW! This is a movement about family members having their loved one's LIVES ripped away by Illegitimate State Violence.

...The mental gymnastics you'd have to do to logically rest with the idea that BLM is somehow "anti-family", wow, ok buddy.

So nope, your little yugi-oh card does is not such a good uno-reverso, after all ♥

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by dang on Friday October 01, 2021 @05:12AM (#28716216)
The two of you broke the site guidelines egregiously with this flamewar. We ban accounts that do that, so no more of this, please—it's not what HN is for and it destroys what it is for.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by xupybd on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @01:46PM (#28697258)
Are neo Nazis still active enough to be a significant part of the conflict around BLM? I was under the impression that while they're hateful and dangerous aholes, there numbers were so low to that interactions with them were rare?
Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by balancemayvary on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @02:03PM (#28697525)
https://twitter.com/VicBergerIV/status/1306805724975046659

This supercut should illustrate the way neo-nazis such as the proud boys [1]

are normalized and swept under the rug. Some 30% of the US voters will enthusiastically support such groups, and another ~20% happily look the other way.

Fascism is like a weed that must be continually demonstrated against. Else you end up with police departments executing their own countrymen in the street, pregnant and naked, gun to the back of the head; convinced that if they don't they "betray their brothers in arms". [2]

It is an insidious ideology brought about by increasingly desperate conditions of the proletariat and stoked by "might makes right" worship of the "glorious leader".

[1] https://www.rawstory.com/2020/11/civil-war-brewing-inside-pr...

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Police

Learn from history, because it's already repeating itself.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by xupybd on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @02:43PM (#28698071)
Ah I see, the term neo-nazi no longer requires a direct connection to the Nazi ideology.

I tend to reserve the label for those that follow the philosophy's that inspired the Nazis such as the white supremacists Houston Stewart Chamberlain. I'd expect them to hold to racial purity beliefs.

I guess language changes but it does seem imprecise.

I'd say one of the dangers history teaches is the mistake of painting the other tribe as a monster. When you no longer see them as human you become a monster yourself and can justify ugly behavior.

The other is a fellow human capable of change, of redemption.

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Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by MandieD on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @04:20PM (#28699372)
“… it was exported from white supremacist America to Germany.”

Stumbling upon that particular panel in the permanent exhibit at the Dokumentationszentrum at the former Reichsparteitagsgelände (“Nazi Rally Grounds”) in Nuremberg was an eye-opener - I have a sharp memory of seeing it the first time. The Nazis borrowed heavily from the Jim Crow laws that were still in force in the US South.

Note: the Dokumentationszentrum is a completely different, though complementary museum to the Nürnberger Prozess Memorium (“Nuremberg Trials museum”). Though far less well-known, I think it’s the more important of the two (the other is worthwhile, don’t get me wrong!)

How does a “normal,” “cultured” Western country go from being a fragile democracy to Hell on Earth for many of its erstwhile citizens and neighbors? Relatively little space there is spent on post-1939; at that point, individual resistance was futile, and there are many other sites that cover the greater horrors of the second half of the Nazi regime, but focuses on 1931-1939, when it might have been possible to stop.

The display text is mostly in German, but the English language audio guide is good. If any of you ever visit Nuremberg, I will walk you through it.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by xupybd on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @06:53PM (#28701046)
>How does a “normal,” “cultured” Western country go from being a fragile democracy to Hell on Earth for many of its erstwhile citizens and neighbors?

This something that deserves more thought in the modern day. Not only did it happen in Germany, hell on earth broke out in the Soviet union and North Korea.

We really need to avoid repeating those mistakes.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by sidlls on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @12:23PM (#28695892)
What if I disagree with some of the approaches of BLM activists?
Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by balancemayvary on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @12:36PM (#28696131)
You are free to disagree, but that doesn't change the facts of the matter.

A youtube channel by Saint Andrewism is a wonderful educational source which covers all the matters at hand in detail.

In particular, you may be interested in the history discussed in "The case against the Gu!IIotine", as well as "Nonviolence, a path to freedom?"

I'd also suggest Beau of the 5th Column; he has bite-sized five minute "Let's talk about"s which address specific current events as they develop, and add context via a short history lesson.

I'd finally point out that the State Monopoly on Violence is inherent.

I'd also point out that MLK was white-washed, and that neoliberal white culture curated the parts of his speeches what suited it.

I'd love to tell people that violence isn't the answer, but I can't do that unless I'm ready to feed them.

This quote, too, also is logical to me: Malatesta: "Violence .. is eminently corrupting." largely paraphrasing this one but it rings true to the authors original sentiment.

So, in short, you can feel lucky, because you have the privilege to take whichever side in debate you choose, and you don't have to feel the collective grief and anxiety [which comes with] being targeted for something as arbitrary as the amount of melanin in your epidermis.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by xupybd on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @01:54PM (#28697391)
I think the argument isn't generally that non violence is always the only option it's that the current situation doesn't warrant violence.

I understand this is a subjective point of view as it is in response to police violence.

If things are as bad as the media suggests, that racist cops are targeting and killing black men and getting away with it then yes they system needs to be over thrown and the argument to use violence is easy to make.

But many don't believe things are that bad. I don't know as I don't live in these neighborhoods. But I think it's valuable to examine why people disagree on the issue.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by balancemayvary on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @02:16PM (#28697712)
Hey, that's fine, but keep in mind:

Black people don't want to be used as a political football.

Black people accrue psychic trauma every time another news story like this breaks. It's communal mourning.

Being able to "examine the issue" without being at this disadvantage is a privilege.

https://medium.com/@OfcrACab/confessions-of-a-former-bastard...

We are all affected, but some much more harshly than others.

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Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by staysafeanon on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @04:17PM (#28699326)
My Power Level: Uncomfortable narrative shattering facts
Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by staysafeanon on Thursday September 30, 2021 @12:39PM (#28708293)
Flagged comment above:

>Black people don't want to be used as a political football.

No one does.

>Black people accrue psychic trauma every time another news story like this breaks. It's communal mourning.

They're so fragile. Sad.

>Being able to "examine the issue" without being at this disadvantage is a privilege.

This is so 2021 I audibly chuckled. "Objectively examining issues and staying rational is White supremacy culture!"

>https://medium.com/@OfcrACab/confessions-of-a-former-bastard...

Of course! A random Medium post by "Officer A. Cab"! Anyone spreading a bet line on this being a Russian outlet or an antwinkfa member writing fan fiction?

>We are all affected, but some much more harshly than others.

Somethings affect children more harshly than adults, no doubt.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by xupybd on Thursday September 30, 2021 @03:16AM (#28703940)
It's over 9000!

Sorry I couldn't resist.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by staysafeanon on Thursday September 30, 2021 @12:33PM (#28708235)
Hah! It definitely is.
Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by professoretc on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @06:18PM (#28700722)
> Black people accrue psychic trauma every time another news story like this breaks. > Being able to "examine the issue" without being at this disadvantage is a privilege.

Whenever I read something like this, the cynic in me wants to reply, "If <insert group> are really that psychologically fragile, clearly they're not ready to participate fully in a liberal democratic society, which necessarily requires being to separate oneself and one's emotions from the issues being discussed."

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by pleomonnt on Thursday September 30, 2021 @12:04AM (#28703050)
As a matter of fact, every <insert group> is really that psychologically fragile. No more so than a certain <insert group> that is too "psychologically fragile" to handle the terrible burden of having a really well paid, cushy, slack-happy desk job with great benefits and WFH freedom, without a new article about burnout reaching the HN front page every week.

As for "being to separate oneself and one's emotions from the issues being discussed"...

- That would disqualify effectively much every participant in a modern liberal democracy, rendering it a non-democracy.

- That doesn't make much sense to begin with, as the impact of issues and policy on "oneself and one's emotions" is the fundamental measure of good/bad even if you're a robotic utilitarian.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by pianoben on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @12:39PM (#28696166)
This is called having a "nuanced perspective". It's something of a lost art these days.
Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by balancemayvary on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @04:10PM (#28699241)
It's not nuanced if you're ignoring the history. Root cause analysis is painstaking, and ignorance is bliss.

https://forwardky.com/beau-takes-on-crt-and-indoctrination/ I'd never want to be on the side of people saying "Don't learn that"...that's all I'm saying.

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by staysafeanon on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @02:26PM (#28697844)
>If you oppose the idea that Black Lives Matter, that's a white supremacist talking point.

No it's not. It's a factual, logical talking point. If you oppose the idea that Black lives matter, then you're being a racist. Black Lives Matter != Black lives matter

>If [anonymous, spontaneously organizing locals counter-protesting white supremacists aka] Anti-fascists oppose you...it's because you're being an asshole.

"We call ourselves the Anti-Bad Guy squad and we label our opponents Bad Guys. How can people not understand this? We can never be terrorists because we're fighting the Bad Guys. It's so simple to understand. Everything we do is justified because of our name."[0]

You've become so predictable (NPC) someone meme'd you years ago.

[0] https://img.ifunny.co/images/9417ddbc95c84c211735c10ddb52b2a...

Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by balancemayvary on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @03:42PM (#28698858)
ok
Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by jtdev on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @01:15PM (#28696770)
Antifa doesn't simply "oppose" those they disagree with.. they engage in actual violence. You've clearly adopted a cultist mindset...
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Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by jtdev on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @02:04PM (#28697540)
The tactics of one who's arguments crumble in the slightest glimmer of sunlight... I hope one day you can understand how hateful your positions are.
Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by balancemayvary on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @02:12PM (#28697650)
I hope you realize that you're projecting, because what you're saying applies perfectly to you.
Re:Almost All of Facebook’s Top Christian Pages in 2019 Run ... by staysafeanon on Wednesday September 29, 2021 @03:10PM (#28698420)
I hope you realize that you're projecting, because what you're saying applies perfectly to you.