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Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by nradov on Wednesday July 28, 2021 @06:16PM (#27990469)
There's nothing reasonable about these regulations. If we want people to use less electricity then raise taxes on electricity and the free market will sort it out. Power is fungible.
Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by eigenvector on Wednesday July 28, 2021 @08:05PM (#27991279)
If people want to use less electricity, they need to have reasonable options to do so in the marketplace without needing a computer engineering degree to figure what sleep states their motherboard supports. That's one purpose of these regulatory mandates: to make the market more transparent and efficient.

Consumers shouldn't have to waste time sorting through products that are broken from day 1 in non-obvious ways.

Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by iammisc on Thursday July 29, 2021 @12:57PM (#27998616)
> Consumers shouldn't have to waste time sorting through products that are broken from day 1 in non-obvious ways.

They're broken via legislation, not any fundamental part of the product.

Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by neolog on Thursday July 29, 2021 @03:03PM (#28000097)
Hm? This is a computer that doesn't have a lower-power mode when you're not using it.
Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by bko on Wednesday July 28, 2021 @07:14PM (#27990956)
Taking a step back, I don't see how we got from a government's role is to protect citizens from foreign invasion to determining what kind of computers gamers can buy through some byzantine energy scoring system. If you mentioned this as a possibility ten or twenty years ago as a slippery slope argument, most people would have thought you're crazy.
Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by jsmith99 on Thursday July 29, 2021 @04:34AM (#27994213)
That's exactly the point - sleep states and efficiency is indeed 'byzantine' and I don't see how you expect individual purchasers to understand it. 'Byzantine' complicated things are exactly where regulation is needed to help.
Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by iammisc on Thursday July 29, 2021 @01:00PM (#27998650)
> sleep states and efficiency is indeed 'byzantine' and I don't see how you expect individual purchasers to understand it

You charge people a lot of money for electricity, and then this motivates them to learn it. A lot of 'byzantine' things are routine. A lot of the rituals we do with computers today would seem incredibly bizarre, and difficult to a person from 200 years ago. For example, on PCs, I hit the 'return' key to make a new line. Or on most computers, Cmd/Ctrl-V is often used to paste things. What does the letter V have to do with pasting anything? It's completely arbitrary and byzantine and the knowledge is frankly rarely mentioned and it's unclear to me how anyone learns it other than by mentorship. And yet, the entire population is more than happy to engage.

Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by fragmede on Thursday July 29, 2021 @02:18PM (#27999665)
> You charge people a lot of money for electricity, and then this motivates them to learn it.

I challenge you to understand that, while this may seem reasonable to you, is not how humans operate. Especially in a household of multiple humans over which you have little/no direct control over, and multiple changes within a given month (the typical billing period for electricity). If you, your partner, your son, and your daughter have all gotten new, power hungry devices, and it's now also winter/snowing outside/aka the bill is expected to be high due to seasonal heating costs, and the a new, punitive rate plan has been put into effect, how could a non-technical consumer even start to address the change in electrical cost? Other than pay the now-exorbitant bill.

Regulations are the answer for the real world where people live. We can debate what the regulations themselves should say, but expecting human nature to suddenly change and that everyone should want to get an EE degree in their free time, just because their electricity bill is mysteriously higher, is not how I would approach trying to effect large sweeping cultural changes. Not when we can't even get a quorum of people vaccinated.

Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by tafda on Wednesday July 28, 2021 @11:06PM (#27992372)
CAFE standards for automobile gas mileage have been around since 1975. Perhaps less a slippery slope and more the reality that America isn't a libertarian state?
Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by ryan_lane on Wednesday July 28, 2021 @09:40PM (#27991872)
How do you know which computer you need to buy to lower your energy consumption, if there's no transparency around which ones use lower energy? The point of regulations like this is to make this clear, and to force companies to compete on features they'd otherwise not care about.

The biggest problem with libertarian solutions is that they're regressive taxes, politically presented as "freedom".

Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by _lazlo on Wednesday July 28, 2021 @10:39PM (#27992207)
Libertarians acknowledge the need for regulations. The importance is that they are stable and apply to everyone equally. Labels for food that list ingredients is great because it has been fair and stable as an example.
Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by ryan_lane on Thursday July 29, 2021 @12:31AM (#27992798)
The regulation being discussed is fair and stable and applies to everyone equally. Most appliances in your house are energy regulated; it's actually odd that computers are not. So, if anything you're arguing for the regulations discussed.

"Letting the market decide" is not a form of regulation.

Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by _lazlo on Friday July 30, 2021 @06:46PM (#28013349)
Maybe, I’m not am expert on this computer topic. I just wanted to highlight the libertarian opinion on regulations.

The main goal of libertarians is to get prices to work. The alternative that i fear we are heading towards is price controls then mandated requirements for output. E.g produce 100 loafs of bread today that will sell for $1.00 or off to jail you go.

Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by cratermoon on Thursday July 29, 2021 @02:24AM (#27993442)
Oh, just let The Free Market Fairy, solve our problems, eh? https://bitworking.org/news/2008/01/the-free-market-fairy/
Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by ALittleLight on Thursday July 29, 2021 @02:34AM (#27993503)
How is using taxes to get an outcome you want an example of the "free market"?
Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by cratermoon on Thursday July 29, 2021 @02:39AM (#27993532)
Parent comment explicitly invoked it:

> raise taxes on electricity and the free market will sort it out.

Re:US States Banning Gaming PCs? Here's What's Going On by mr_toad on Wednesday July 28, 2021 @06:23PM (#27990532)
They probably wasted more energy while drafting these laws than they’re going to save.