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Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by david-cako on Sunday May 09, 2021 @08:58PM (#27101503)
Who was it again that has the most effective intelligence community and military in the world?
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by neartheplain on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:34PM (#27101745)
I hope you're not talking about the CIA, whose network of agents in China (to pick one example) was rounded up and killed due to either shoddy IT work or a mole in the Agency. Either possiblity reflects poorly on the American intelligence community:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-china-espionage-idUSK...

>Investigators remain divided over whether there was a spy within the Central Intelligence Agency who betrayed the sources or whether the Chinese hacked the CIA’s covert communications system, the newspaper reported, citing current and former U.S. officials.

>The Chinese killed at least a dozen people providing information to the CIA from 2010 through 2012, dismantling a network that was years in the making, the newspaper reported.

>One was shot and killed in front of a government building in China, three officials told the Times, saying that was designed as a message to others about working with Washington.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by knowaveragejoe on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:40PM (#27101780)
This isn't a counter-argument against the person you're replying to, though. One can pick from numerous examples of the inverse(though the US doesn't round them up & disappear them, they go through the court system)
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by johnisgood on Sunday May 09, 2021 @10:45PM (#27102170)
> though the US doesn't round them up & disappear them, they go through the court system

Yeah, unless you are suspected for terrorism. I recommend the movie named The Mauritanian.

> Mohamedou Ould Slahi (Arabic: محمدو ولد الصلاحي‎) (born December 21, 1970) is a Mauritanian man who was detained at Guantánamo Bay detention camp without charge from 2002 until his release on October 17, 2016.

> The book, Guantánamo Diary, was published in January 2015. It is the first work by a still-imprisoned detainee at Guantánamo. It provides details of Slahi's harsh interrogations and torture, including being "force-fed seawater, sexually molested, subjected to a mock execution and repeatedly beaten, kicked and smashed across the face, all spiced with threats that his mother will be brought to Guantánamo and gang-raped.[1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohamedou_Ould_Slahi

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by adventured on Sunday May 09, 2021 @11:25PM (#27102392)
In a country of 330 million people, with massively global interests, you're going to have to do a lot better than rare examples.

In a country so large with so many different government agencies, entities, organizations, and interests, just about anything you can think of will have happened at some point. The question is whether it's going on at large scale, whether it's the common practice or rare.

You're trying to use one example to prove that the practice is common, when in fact that's false, it's not common it's rare. It's the exception, not the rule; which is exactly why it makes for an attention getting story.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by johnisgood on Sunday May 09, 2021 @11:34PM (#27102436)
I have no idea whether it is happening or not at a large enough scale. I did not mean to prove anything, just wished to shed light on it.

How do we know it is not happening though? Think about pre-Snowden.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by baybal2 on Monday May 10, 2021 @05:06AM (#27104064)
> In a country of 330 million people, with massively global interests, you're going to have to do a lot better than rare examples.

USA doesn't have massive global interest. Maybe its companies, but not it's state. USA is a very insular, and static system of a state.

It's a good example what happens in those very few cases when the machine of US state moves, and what is characteristic of it.

A meaningful political reform will start with somebody starting to uncork it, and forcefully subjecting it to contact with outside world.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by l33t2328 on Monday May 10, 2021 @01:04AM (#27102880)
Okay, first of all, we have no reason to remotely assume those executed were CIA agents; it’s far(far) more likely they were CIA assets, local people recruited by agents to sell secrets. Assets are captured regularly.

Even still, do you expect any intelligence agency to be perfect? I’m not sure what point you’re trying to prove here.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by stolen_biscuit on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:16PM (#27101632)
Intelligence I'd say probably Russia right? They've made America look quite incompetent the past decade or so. Military I'd say America although I don't think SEAL team 6 is going to be hunting down these attackers
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by peteretep on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:53PM (#27101871)
> They've made America look quite incompetent the past decade or so

This itself is American propoganda; the strategy is to be absolutely all over your opponents, knowing that they can't complain about it for fear of looking weak, while complaining loudly about how their meagre attempts are the end of the world, getting public and Congressional support for more spending.

Before the Snowden leaks, someone suggesting the US had the SIGINT capacities they actually did have would have be laughed out of serious circles as a crank, and you better believe they haven't been sat still over the 8 years since.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by stolen_biscuit on Monday May 10, 2021 @12:51AM (#27102821)
I don't believe the way America has embarrassed itself on the world stage is American propaganda. Russia has repeatedly exploited the stupidity of a few within the upper echelons of the elected American government with a few well placed agents and bots backing up those messages online.
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by JohnJamesRambo on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:27PM (#27101698)
> I don't think SEAL team 6 is going to be hunting down these attackers

It would certainly reduce their enthusiasm for hacking.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by mberger on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:12PM (#27101595)
Why are you bringing Israel into this?
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by SavantIdiot on Monday May 10, 2021 @02:45AM (#27103355)
The effectiveness of the CIA (or government) depends on the narrative of the author. Like the immigrant paradox: are they lazy or are they taking your jobs? which is it?
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by dannyw on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:15PM (#27101621)
In terms of actual execution, definitely not America!
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by ticviking on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:10PM (#27101572)
Pound for pound I'd say Israel.

In absolute terms I'm pretty sure China has us at sea and in cyber so...

Not the US

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by boringg on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:16PM (#27101622)
Pretty sure china doesn't have the oceans - might want to check up on your stats.
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by bob_theslob646 on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:33PM (#27101741)
Not to be rude but I'm pretty sure you need to check up on your stats. The Chinese do have the oceans.

>Citing the Office of Naval Intelligence, a Congressional Research Service report from March notes that the People’s Liberation Army Navy, or PLAN, was slated to have 360 battle force ships by the end of 2020, dwarfing the U.S. fleet of 297 ships.

[1](https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-navy/2021/04/12/chinas-n...)

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by RhodoGSA on Sunday May 09, 2021 @10:51PM (#27102202)
Air Craft carriers and jets were proven in WW2 to be the big differentiator. US took note and has more than the entire world combined. 'Battle force ships' is a very loose term and your source only includes navy resources. You forget we have Army, Air force, Marines and not to forget coast guard that all have their own watercraft. Also, don't know if you've been seeing some of the new SWISS ships the US have been developing. Very small, hyper fast ships with a crew of 6 or less with a crazy amount of firepower in terms of AA, 50 cal, even torpedos. Those aren't categorized as 'Battle Force Ships'.

Also, despite the huge waste that is inherent in it - no one has bases like the US does. We have forward operating bases all over the middle east, geographically separated units all over east europe, africa, asian pacific, and military bases all over europe and every key point of the united states. Nasa never quite got launches down but we do have some of the most advanced satellite, imagery and other military instruments. look up number of military spacecraft by country.

Whether it's moral or not is an entirely different question, but there is a reason the international monetary fund has a weight 44% USD; It's not because all the other countries like us that's for sure.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by totoglazer on Sunday May 09, 2021 @11:59PM (#27102545)
Can’t find anything about the SWISS ships but curious to learn more, if you could provide a link.
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by RhodoGSA on Monday May 10, 2021 @01:33AM (#27103042)
opps - it's SWCC*. Can't seem to find the heavier version, but it was based on the SOC-R.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Operations_Craft_%E2%8...

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by edholland on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:52PM (#27101858)
without significant aircraft carrier fleet i'm not sure china has dominant control of any seas, despite best efforts in south china seas

[1](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_aircraft_carrier_progr...)

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by bob_theslob646 on Sunday May 09, 2021 @10:26PM (#27102070)
https://www.cnn.com/2021/03/05/china/china-world-biggest-nav...

I am not sure what your point is. By number of ships, they are the biggest. I have no idea how important aircraft carrier fleet is.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by boringg on Monday May 10, 2021 @09:47AM (#27105927)
Biggest by number, not by capability or weight. There are significant differences as a result.

I.e. who cares if you have the most swordsmen on the planet, if you in a gunfight.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by pbourke on Sunday May 09, 2021 @11:09PM (#27102300)
> I have no idea how important aircraft carrier fleet is.

It’s the most important part of a modern blue water navy and has been since WW2. The US also has a world-dominating submarine fleet.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by throwaway20148 on Sunday May 09, 2021 @10:28PM (#27102079)
Bath Iron Works is hiring people on the spot right now. They are probably going to hire 3k people in the next year. I imagine this is happening at other shipyards around the country. Expect those ship numbers to be revised upwards.
Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by boringg on Monday May 10, 2021 @09:45AM (#27105908)
I don't dispute the ability for China to produce more ships than the US or have more ships. By tonnage they are still less than half the size of the the US fleet and they aren't in control of the oceans. I'm not saying that won't change I am merely flagging OP statements as inaccurate.

Don't worry I don't take your comments as rude.

Re:US passes emergency waiver over fuel pipeline cyber-attack by ruskimir on Sunday May 09, 2021 @09:11PM (#27101588)
We should use it and shut down Russian pipelines. The Russian government is supporting and harboring DarkSide. It's possible the state directed this attack through them for plausible deniability.