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Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by indigochill on Saturday May 08, 2021 @01:37AM (#27084233)
This version didn't exist until GistNoesis flipped the sign, so no, it's not.

This gets to a larger philosophy of open source: we should encourage people to fork when they want to iterate on someone else's work, however minor that iteration may be. This is open source working as intended.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @04:34AM (#27085124)
If you take something that took hours to build and (as is claimed) spend 1 minute modifying it, you absolutely have no right to claim it’s “by” you. I think everyone except you agrees on that.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by franciscop on Saturday May 08, 2021 @05:11AM (#27085300)
Well they also changed the name, so this new concept of Lovetris is by the new author, even if the code to make it possible is not. Lots of references to the old work as well, similar distribution (e.g. not paid), etc. If I was the author of Hatetris I'd be happy for this version!
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @05:31AM (#27085421)
> they also changed the name

Is that a serious argument? If you write a techno song, and I take it, turn up the BPM and publish it as “by me”, would it help my case that I also changed the name of the song?

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by franciscop on Saturday May 08, 2021 @06:07AM (#27085628)
I'd like to welcome you to the world of Nightcore:

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=nightcore

But in more seriousness, a song is normally quite distinguishable from another song than a tetris implementation from another tetris implementation. Conceptually, having a normal tetris vs having a tetris give you the worst solution (hatris) is the same jump as having a normal tetris vs having a tetris give you the best solution (lovetris). IMHO it's not the code itself what makes a "new thing new", it's the concept behind it.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @06:27AM (#27085740)
I completely disagree. I made a hatetris myself (called Lövetris) once, spent a good 20 hours on it. If someone took it, flipped a sign (or even re-skinned it) and published it as “by” them I’d be furious.

Yes, the product would be different, but 99.9% (literally) of the work would still be mine. The hard part is building the app, not changing a parameter. I wouldn’t even call that a “remix”.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by franciscop on Saturday May 08, 2021 @07:23AM (#27086102)
That seems the opposite of open source thinking, which might be why you didn't published it and why you think that way. As an open source author myself I see this as a fair move. Just different opinions :)

"The hard part is building the app, not changing a parameter" that really depends, why didn't you take an open source implementation yourself and built on top of it? Then it wouldn't be "as hard", would it? If you want to go the hard road that's totally fine, but it's not fair to say that because you go that road you deserve something that someone else got easier using pre-existing technology. Also there's literally dozens of famous examples in science and medicine when the hard part is changing a parameter and saving millions of lives.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @10:12AM (#27087293)
Also, I’m not saying it’s a problem to tweak someone’s open source project, I only take issue with presenting it as your own, with such a minimal change.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by frosted-flakes on Saturday May 08, 2021 @11:20AM (#27087924)
If you want attribution, require it in the licence.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @11:46AM (#27088174)
Maybe I’m not being clear. I’m talking about _etiquette_. Not licenses or laws.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @07:35AM (#27086168)
I don’t know if there are open source hatetris available, but in my case it was an assignment so that wasn’t an option.

If i build something from scratch it doesn’t really matter that it “could have been” built on open source. And in any case, it might be perfectly legal and in accordance with the license to do what OP did, I’m just saying it’s bad form. Making a minor tweak doesn’t make it “by you”. It just doesn’t.

And this is not medicine and lovetris doesn’t save any lives, so I’m bot sure it’s relevant.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by thinkingemote on Saturday May 08, 2021 @06:33AM (#27085780)
Did you give an open source license to your project? I think some licenses have better attribution requirements than others.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @07:09AM (#27086011)
I didn’t publish it at all, I’m just thinking hypothetically here!
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by thinkingemote on Saturday May 08, 2021 @11:50AM (#27088217)
Good idea! If more thought hypothetically about the consequences of various licenses I think it would be a good thing.

In retrospect some of my projects might have more liberal WTFPL on them where I really don't care if someone else said they did it, but others I would want more recognition and more copy left for their changes. (I think some of my bigger projects side with the copy left and the smaller with the liberal.)

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by tobr on Saturday May 08, 2021 @05:07AM (#27085274)
> I think everyone except you agrees on that

As a member of “everyone”, would you please not put words in my mouth.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by zepolen on Saturday May 08, 2021 @09:12AM (#27086831)
Everyone is so touchy.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @05:29AM (#27085410)
”I think”
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by LocalH on Saturday May 08, 2021 @06:58AM (#27085934)
Well, you've been given an example that contradicts your "thinking", so either your "thinking" was unknowingly incorrect, or you now choose to believe something that is patently false.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by bombcar on Saturday May 08, 2021 @10:25AM (#27087401)
The TeX license requires you to change the name of you change a single byte.

> All of the methods described in these books are in the public domain; thus anybody can freely use any of the ideas. The only thing I'm retaining control of is the names, TeX and METAFONT: products that go by this name are obliged to conform to the standard. If any changes are made, I won't complain, as long as the changed systems are not called TeX or METAFONT.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @10:40AM (#27087514)
What is your argument here?
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by bombcar on Saturday May 08, 2021 @10:36PM (#27092685)
That open source licenses exist that REQUIRE you take credit the moment you fiddle with the source, so it’s not universally despised to do so.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by GistNoesis on Saturday May 08, 2021 @11:50AM (#27088211)
Thanks for the remark.

There already was a link on the github readme to give credit to the original hatetris (MIT licensed).

In addition I have added some link to qtnm hatetris on the play page, too.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by thinkingemote on Saturday May 08, 2021 @06:29AM (#27085761)
The MIT license states the rights, I thought?
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @07:11AM (#27086025)
I’m not saying it’s illegal, I’m saying it’s bad form.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by dylan604 on Saturday May 08, 2021 @11:09AM (#27087822)
This is hanging on the edge of being "I don't like it or disagree with it, therefore it is bad"
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Grustaf on Saturday May 08, 2021 @11:47AM (#27088190)
You could say that. Most discussions outside science lans and courts of laws are about opinions, not objective facts.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by learnstats2 on Saturday May 08, 2021 @02:38AM (#27084541)
The Hatetris code doesn’t appear to have an open source license, or any license, so it isn’t open source.

This use of the code is a clear legal breach of copyright, in the absence of specific agreement with the copyright holder.

(On the Hatetris page, the author declines someone’s request to use the code elsewhere)

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Jon_Lowtek on Saturday May 08, 2021 @03:30AM (#27084812)
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by learnstats2 on Saturday May 08, 2021 @01:08PM (#27088931)
I'm not sure I deserve to be so downvoted for this, considering this clarification came after my comment ;(
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by haneefmubarak on Saturday May 08, 2021 @03:58PM (#27090175)
I didn't downvote you, but I want to clarify what's going on because I know it sucks to get down voted with explanation.

The reason you're getting so many down votes is because you made strong claims in a harsh tone that turned out to be false in a trivially verifiable manner. The intent there is that you should've verified your claim through and through before attributing a misdeed to someone who simply sought to share something they thought was cool to make with others.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by learnstats2 on Sunday May 09, 2021 @10:24AM (#27096120)
I find it important to identify that yes, a license is required to use someone else’s code - I mean this legally, not morally: you can be sued.

The sibling points about trademark law (which is different) and remix culture (which has some legal protection but not that I’m aware for lines of code) seem to miss this point.

This is a licensed use, it turns out, which is great. If the author here had not identified that before publishing, then they were putting themselves at legal risk.

[on a technicality, the MIT license hasn’t been properly invoked, since the MIT license requires the text of the license to be included in full, but the original author’s consent for use seems now to be clear]

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Pfhreak on Saturday May 08, 2021 @02:44AM (#27084559)
I mean, Hatetris probably wasn't using the Tetris trademarks properly, right? Aren't both just remix culture?
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by simondotau on Saturday May 08, 2021 @02:56AM (#27084624)
Morally? I suppose if you squint hard enough.

Legally though, just because one person's proprietary work relies upon another person's proprietary work, doesn't mean it suddenly becomes open source or public domain.

Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by Pfhreak on Saturday May 08, 2021 @10:29AM (#27087425)
I'm just surprised the community made the critique on this version but not the other one.
Re:Show HN: Lovetris – Tetris which always gives you the bes... by simondotau on Saturday May 08, 2021 @10:09PM (#27092550)
Honestly I’m not surprised. The prior work could be argued as being fair use of the Tetris copyright. It certainly isn’t stealing any market from any official licensed Tetris products or services. Morally, I can find it very easily defensible.

This “Lovetris” work is a blatant copying and republishing of someone else’s proprietary work effort with no permission. Morally, I don’t see this as an egregious abuse, but I can see why this community would object to someone not acting in the spirit of open source licensing.