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Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by alpaca128 on Friday April 23, 2021 @06:59AM (#26913371)
Are there similar platforms for buying ebooks?

I like ebooks but I'm not comfortable with all the layers of DRM involved in it.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by ChrisMarshallNY on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:41AM (#26913668)
Yeeeesssss.....buuuuut....

Only for certain books.

Book DRM has been a nightmare. Tying a book to certain readers is an automatic showstopper for a lot of folks (like me). I recently bounced a tech book I purchased, because I had to download their crappy hybrid app to read the book. The same people that sold it to me, used to sell unlocked reflowable EPUBs (my preferred format), or watermarked PDFs (I have no problem with simple margin watermarks). I'll lay odds that the app they make you use phones home. I didn't bother downloading it, or reviewing their privacy policy.

I'm not so concerned with privacy, as I am, with perpetual access to the books I want to read, on whatever reader I want to use.

I often go back and re-read books, years after the the last time I read them. I want to have that book available, then.

Also, this goes for all types of media, region locks are garbage.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by sammorrowdrums on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:52AM (#26913744)
Adding for people who want sources:

There are quite a few places especially technical ones. However, many major pulishers don't offer them, so you then have the choice of DRM stripping, searching for illegitimate copies or giving up/in and using a DRM copy somehow.

https://www.ebooks.com/en-nl/drm-free/

https://leanpub.com/

https://www.libreture.com/bookshops/

Note places like ebooks.com don't sell exclusively DRM free, so you will need to check per book. I returned one to them and got a refund because of my mistake in buying a DRMd copy.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by FabHK on Friday April 23, 2021 @09:34AM (#26914587)
For free books in the public domain, https://standardebooks.org

> Standard Ebooks is a volunteer-driven project that produces new editions of public domain ebooks that are lovingly formatted, open source, free of copyright restrictions, and free of cost.

(Not affiliated, just think they do great work!

Discussed before:

2019 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20594802

2020 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25138534 )

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by bayindirh on Friday April 23, 2021 @09:39AM (#26914636)
Add Manning, No Starch Press, InformIT (Pearson) to that list.

They somehow watermark your books though, but they don't contain any DRM.

O'Reilly was very good. Now they only rent their books via Safari. I feel betrayed.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by sitkack on Friday April 23, 2021 @08:33AM (#26914035)
Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by abawany on Friday April 23, 2021 @01:28PM (#26917043)
One approach I've used in lieu of buying ebooks is to buy a used/new print copy, get it destructively scanned, and thus acquire a drm-free copy of the book. Often this can work out cheaper than buying the ebook.
Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by lrvick on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:31PM (#26920499)
Sadly many of the books I buy are quite rare, and getting a destructive scan would be a crime against humanity.

One could argue it is ethical, if not legal, to obtain a drm-free digital backup from a pirate site if one has a physical copy on their shelf.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by lrvick on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:12AM (#26913467)
I looked and looked and looked for an option here, and almost pulled the trigger on book scanning gear.

Eventually I gave up realizing it is an extraordinary effort to personally rip books just to have drm-free digital copies.

Instead I built a floor-to-ceiling bookshelf and filled it.

I read ink on slices of dead trees now, like a barbarian.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by throws23577 on Friday April 23, 2021 @08:01AM (#26913815)
That's one of my dreams, floor to ceiling bookshelves filled with books. Can't you try 'Calibre' [1] instead of paid book scanning gear? It's GPL.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calibre_(software)

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by lrvick on Friday April 23, 2021 @08:18AM (#26913930)
That means buying the DRM copies in the first place, further contributing to that system. Also it is a PITA.

Pretty much all e-paper readers are proprietary and track all reading too which is a second order problem.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by Qwertious on Friday April 23, 2021 @01:38PM (#26917153)
IMO the long-term solution is attaching an author-payment system widget to pirate sites. It's not illegal to pay authors, so a payment system can't be DMCA'd, and pirate websites pop back up like weeds and can't realistically be stamped out. Magnet links are way too portable for that and anyone can spin up a new VPS with 100MB or so of data (the size of TPB's db IIRC) to keep on going.
Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by lrvick on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:08PM (#26920308)
Honestly, this is an amazing idea be if for individual creators or studios. It should also have a way to tag specific media that caused them to want to contribute so it is a wallet vote for more like this.

Really all creators should just have anonymous donation options for people that want to support -them- without supporting the toxic labels and DRM situation.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by abawany on Friday April 23, 2021 @01:26PM (#26917021)
There are ebook scanning services that do a great job. I have used bookscan.us for hundreds of books for years and it works well.
Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by lrvick on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:27PM (#26920473)
The only issue I have is most of them require the destruction of the book by removing the pages. Many of mine are very rare and collectible now costing hundreds of dollars so it would be a crime to damage them.

Do you know of services that can do this without damage?

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by abawany on Saturday April 24, 2021 @02:43AM (#26922776)
I unfortunately don't know of any services that do this non destructively. However, there are scanner designs that Archive.org use to scan rare books. I'll try to find references but I think they'll require construction - afaik, no one sells such a scanner ready to purchase.

Edit: Ask and ye shall receive: https://www.amazon.com/Fujitsu-ScanSnap-SV600-Overhead-Scann... - had no idea this existed. Very tempting - Fujitsu makes solid scanners .

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by lofi_lory on Friday April 23, 2021 @08:50AM (#26914202)
Ironically, DRM drives me towards Z-Lib and Libgen, when I happily payed No Starch for their stuff. Especially their bundles are a smart move in the digital age.

Also, see e.g. Steam, you cannot charge for these digital goods the way you used to. It's shifting towards (searchable) collections, not just individual books. It's ridiculous, when digital edition cost almost as much as print. They are emotionally and functionally different things.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by ineedasername on Friday April 23, 2021 @10:10AM (#26914955)
I used to work in the industry: Print really isn't much more expensive to produce than ebooks, so there's not a huge different in cost.

A hardcover will cost around $3-$4 in printing costs. Even still, ebooks can be a good deal. To use a recent example that wouldn't yet have any digital discounts, there's the John Boehner book [0]. As of this comment, it has an MSRP of $29.99. The Kindle version is $14.99. At actual retail, Barnes & Noble charges $23.99. At Amazon it's $17.99, which makes the savings on print costs a wash.

Mid-size paper backs are usually a fair bit cheaper too. Mass-market editions are the bad deals: In print they retail around $8 to $10, which is usually the ebook cost too. However, many books never make it to mass market editions theses days.

The bulk of the costs involved in bringing a book to market are the people: Time to review the "slush pile", pay the author, editor, copy editor, typesetting, marketing. And many books either lose money for the publisher or barely earn out the author's advance. Mid-list authors who can consistently earn out their advance with a healthy margin are the ones that keep the lights on long enough for the publisher to (hopefully) catch lightning in a bottle with a block buster, or at least an outsized success.

Of course all of the costs above assume you're buying a new copy. Used books are often a very good deal.

[0] https://www.amazon.com/House-John-Boehner/dp/1250238447/ref=...

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by lofi_lory on Friday April 23, 2021 @11:18AM (#26915606)
Thanks for the insights!

Still I think ebooks are a different product. At least in my head. I have a different emotional relationship with a physical book. The information within isn't in competition with the endless a "wealth" of information available legally or not.

For text books piracy is a victimless "crime" in my case, as having a digital copy or not, is independent from financial loss above a certain price tag. That is, I can't afford most text books, so I won't buy them; piracy does not influence the income of the publisher. On the other hand, if I really need/want to buy a book, I am likely gonna get much more intimate with it. Let's face it, digital copies are much more likely not to be read. Maybe only indexed and searched as part of a collection. Digital has a different value. (Although, I ofc understand the superficial dilemma here.)

This is the situation we got IMO.

Side note: You, as someone from the industry, I assume we can both agree that at the very least, a free digital copy should be included with every physical one, right? That just silly and artificial to separate, if you make an argument for the value of content and presentation.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by ineedasername on Friday April 23, 2021 @05:53PM (#26919657)
In the case of text books, if you can't afford it then pirating it can actually be a net-benefit to society. You weren't going to contribute to the economy through purchasing it, but by learning from a pirated copy you increase your knowledge & potential value to society.
Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by lofi_lory on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @10:07AM (#26956009)
I was actually about to write the net benefit bit, but decided against for avoiding some knee jerk reaction of the HN crowd, drowning the argument XD
Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by dsign on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:34AM (#26913604)
Smashwords comes to mind: https://www.smashwords.com/ . Once you buy a book, you get a DRM-free epub that you can open in whichever e-book reader you fancy.

There are in fact more of such stores, but this is the one that I use and remember.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by ceejayoz on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:20AM (#26913512)
You can actually find quite a few on Amazon. Example:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08QGM36KB/

"At the Publisher's request, this title is being sold without Digital Rights Management Software (DRM) applied."

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by __david__ on Friday April 23, 2021 @03:58PM (#26918552)
Yeah, ebooks are particularly egregious because the readers actually have features that are good or bad and being locked into one or two options at the most severely limits how you consume your books.

What I've doing is buying physical books and then downloading DRM free ebook versions from pirate bay. I know not everyone will agree with those ethics, but I'm ok with it.

Re:Apple is sued for telling you that you're “buying” movies by throws23577 on Friday April 23, 2021 @07:57AM (#26913774)
This HN thread has some DRM-free

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26892249