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Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by sudosysgen on Tuesday March 23, 2021 @11:22PM (#26563209)
There is nothing wrong with an attempt of assassination of a fascist genocidal dictator. There is actually no other way of improving things.

I don't see either why one should oppose a plaque for John Brown.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by waterhouse on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @12:14AM (#26563532)
So, how many current world leaders would be on your "justifiable to assassinate" list? Kim Jong-un, perhaps? Should it be official U.S. policy to have the CIA working on trying to kill him? Kim Jong-un presumably thinks we're just as evil as we might think he is; should he feel justified in trying to assassinate the leaders of Western countries? How about Putin, people say he jails his political opponents and rigs his elections, does he count? Should there be a Cold War of Assassination going on?
Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by sudosysgen on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @12:55AM (#26563736)
Killing Kim Jong Un will not make anything better. Foreign state assasinations especially never work out.

Homegrown assasinations of fascist leaders whose basis for power is a projection of strength and a cult of personality, with strong existing domestic oppositions?

That's very different in outcome.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by filmfact on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @03:25AM (#26564432)
I didn’t realize Violet Gibson was Italian.
Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by toyg on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @05:09AM (#26564996)
She had been living in Italy for 4 years at that point.
Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by filmfact on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @05:30AM (#26565120)
Hardly home grown, also I’m 99% sure she had been in Italy for less than 2 years before her attack (November 1924 - April 1926).

By that measure 9-11 was home grown!

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by toyg on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @05:46AM (#26565219)
According to this [0] she had moved to Rome in 1922. Unlike 9-11ers, she didn’t move to the country explicitly to perform the action; she likely grew to dislike Mussolini by spending time in the country. By that metric, I’d call it home-grown.

[0] https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/life/features/profile-viole...

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by filmfact on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @06:44AM (#26565539)
https://dib.cambridge.org/viewReadPage.do?articleId=a10139

Says 1924, and that she was already toying with the idea of martyrdom.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by toyg on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @07:16AM (#26565726)
Also says:

> In her room at the convent Gibson had amassed a collection of newspaper cuttings critical of Mussolini, and others outlining his movements. She also had a box of bullets. The origin of the revolver, her second, was never determined. The lead detective investigating the case believed Gibson was feigning madness and had not acted alone but possibly in collaboration with catholic modernist dissidents from the poor Trastevere neighbourhood. [...]

> In June 1926, succumbing to immense pressure, Gibson made a confession. Her story was that she had committed the crime to impress an Italian duke named Giovanni Colonna, who she had fallen in love with years before in Switzerland. Vehemently opposed to fascism, she claimed Colonna had communicated his desire for Mussolini's death through a series of clues before gifting her with gun and bullets, that led her to the assassination site that fateful day. The duke was under surveillance for anti-fascist activities, and his movements at the time of the shooting could not be accounted for, lending plausibility to Gibson's account.

Clearly this was not the work of a foreign faction, there was a clear element of Italian involvement.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by filmfact on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @07:21AM (#26565762)
Words placed into the mouth of a crazy woman (implicating an enemy of the people asking the questions) who was determined to kill -somebody- it’s mentioned elsewhere that she may have wanted to target the Pope.

Not home grown.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by toyg on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @09:33AM (#26566957)
The authorities did not even believe her, so I don't see why they would "plant" words in her mouth...

Anyway, there is no point arguing about this.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by filmfact on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @06:12PM (#26573684)
Because the ‘authorities’ are not a single person, factions within organizations often pull in different directions.

Will you at least concede the point that she’d been in Italy for less than 2 years?

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by filmfact on Friday March 26, 2021 @09:26PM (#26599001)
To be clear: Violet Gibson was in no way Italian or connected in any meaningful way to Italy.

One might also observe that the violent attack in a foreign country might almost be ‘Imperialist’.

And if the attack was politically motivated (I personally think she was a few sandwiches short of a picnic), then she’s down for some political violence.

In that case she’s a bit more facist than anti-facist.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by tomc1985 on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @01:04AM (#26563796)
I mean sure, and they're certainly welcome to try. But the balance of world power, and all the things those powers do to ensure that power, almost certainly guarantees failure.
Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by Synaesthesia on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @12:32AM (#26563615)
Why not start with the leaders of the USA, Israel and the West for their notorious war crimes?

At least North Korea hasn't invaded anyone for the last 60 years. As they said in the Nuremberg trials, aggression is the ultimate war crimes, a capital one.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by throwaway210222 on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @06:16AM (#26565380)
"USA, Israel and the West"

What is the point of including the USA and Israel if you are going to append the West?

Or was it too hard to list the individual perpetrators and just went for what felt good?

[PS. Not a westerner]

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by anoncake on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @06:12AM (#26565359)
To kill the leaders of democracies would be genocide.
Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by filmfact on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @03:09AM (#26564348)
But at the time she pulled the trigger, he was neither a dictator or genocidal.

Perhaps violence is the right way to address all people who have politics we don’t agree with?

Thomas Mair agrees with you.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by sudosysgen on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @08:31AM (#26566308)
Whether political violence is warranted rests upon three factors. Firstly, one must consider if you are initiating political violence or simply reacting - which sadly is necessary. Mussolini obviously had instigated political violence much before.

Then, one must consider efficacy - if it's going to be useless then why bother?

Finally, one must consider the presence of altermatives. If you can at all avoid it, then political violence is not really justifiable.

In this case, the three elements converged, and it's in those cases that political violence can be warranted if done for good. This isn't even controversial, people defend the violence of the US Founding Fathers which engaged in much more violence for much, much, much less.

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by filmfact on Thursday March 25, 2021 @06:18AM (#26578369)
I fundamentally disagree. On such a basis a white supremisist could justify murder against the ‘violent’ state in the absence of the possibilty of being elected.

Presumably on that basis you see the killing of Jo Cox as justified?

Re:The Irish Woman Who Shot Mussolini by toyg on Wednesday March 24, 2021 @04:48AM (#26564881)
> at the time she pulled the trigger, he was neither a dictator or genocidal

Historians typically mark the official beginning of Mussolini’s dictatorship in 1924, when, following the assassination of socialist MP Giacomo Matteotti by fascists and the subsequent clamour, he went to Parliament and basically told MPs to “shut up or else”. And let’s not forget that he had been appointed Prime Minister with a de-facto coup in 1922.

As for “genocidal”, I’m not sure what parameters could be used. The infamous invasion of Ethiopia with chemical weapons had not happened yet, and obviously the Racial Laws were a long way away, but he had already begun the “pacification” of Libya (war started in 1923). Also, political violence against the opposition was already large-scale, as shown with Matteotti.

By 1926 it was pretty clear he wasn’t a simple political leader for sure, and he had already spoken at length against representative democracy. Whether that deserved an assassination attempt, is debatable; but there is little question that by 1926 he could be defined as a violent dictator.