Re:Infinite Nature: Perpetual View Generation of Natural Sce...
by mistercow on Saturday March 20, 2021 @03:37PM
(#26525544)
I think the fact that it has short-term but not long-term temporal coherence is part of what gives it that surreal quality. A range of any five frames looks like a plausible view shift, but over longer timeframes, it looks like details are appearing out of the horizon. Still really cool though.
Re:Infinite Nature: Perpetual View Generation of Natural Sce...
by fab1an on Saturday March 20, 2021 @04:55PM
(#26526016)
Really cool. One thing the most boring part of my mind is wondering about when seeing these is related to the legality of stuff like that: many of the drone videos this is trained on are obviously copyrighted, and the system has used them to learn how to come up with novel ones. The same applies to GPT-n, which is trained on massive amounts of copyrighted material, no?
Does anyone know anything about this; there must be a couple of dissertations on this topic by now?
Re:Infinite Nature: Perpetual View Generation of Natural Sce...
by mpoteat on Saturday March 20, 2021 @06:20PM
(#26526472)
A much more salient and important point is generative models relationship to music. Right now, covers are legally protected as derivative works. I predict commercial usage of generative music to avoid royalties within the next decade.
Philosophically, I think that the process of learning - whether by a human or simulacrom - should be protected. That is, if I write a book, I don't need to seek the permission or pay the authors of every book I've ever read. To me, this is the only sane result for a non-dualist materialist who believes neural networks are in principle isomorphic to human minds.
As a matter of law, I believe it will have to be determined on the case law level some point. I'm not a lawyer and this is not legal advice.
Re:Infinite Nature: Perpetual View Generation of Natural Sce...
by yowlingcat on Saturday March 20, 2021 @01:09PM
(#26524462)
Well, I'll be. Combine that with green-screen technology, and I don't really have any excuse to not record myself and set myself to video for my favorite compositions. Thanks for putting this on my radar, friend.
Re:Infinite Nature: Perpetual View Generation of Natural Sce...
by dhsysusbsjsi on Saturday March 20, 2021 @07:53AM
(#26522529)
Agree RE long term consistency. After 10 frames I suspect what I’m seeing from that point is a journey through the trained model internals. It doesn’t seem to reference back to the original image and very quickly changes to vastly different terrain.
Re:Infinite Nature: Perpetual View Generation of Natural Sce...
by aniijbod on Saturday March 20, 2021 @09:55AM
(#26523252)
"very quickly changes to vastly different terrain"
I anticipate potential use-cases ('level/scene generation' in game content creation) where this actually turns out to be the most valuable aspect of the output.
I can't imagine that it would be too much of a stretch to 'start with a photo' as a 'seed' and use it to create a 3D world.
My only concern would be 'sameyness tendency', in other words, the problem would be that a variety of seed photos of similar kinds of scenes would end up creating worlds that were too similar to one another to make 'still photo to fly-through movie to navigable detailed 3D world' a sufficiently 'creative' source of sufficiently differentiated new game worlds (or of sufficiently differentiated new fly-through movies).
I suspect this could all be fixed by 'differentiator algorithms' interfering with the key variables of the 'refinement' process, as well as broadening and continually adding to the range of movies in the training data.
Re:Infinite Nature: Perpetual View Generation of Natural Sce...
by pbhjpbhj on Saturday March 20, 2021 @05:04PM
(#26526054)
For what sort of games?
There's a few ways I see procedural generation as worse than limited [human] curated modelling - you lose the very careful balance, the iterated architecting to enhance game play, you also lose the commonality of experience across players, and if the game is often played you lose an aspect of the player's ability to become expert at the game.
It's natural that game companies will use lots of procedural/ML generation of game aspects; but it's probably going to be "if you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail".
Television had a certain manner of aiding societal cohesion when we only had a few channels (3 when I was little). That meant lots of commonality of experience. It seems [some] games could go the same way - players getting such vast differences of experience that we lose some of that shared experience that binds people together.
Ultimately, a future of us all living in our own entirely unique VR realty seems like some version of hell.
There's something fascinating about the familiar but nonsensical details. Who says a CPU can't go on an acid trip?
You might like this analysis of the phenomena
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0F7XBwFwA-M&vl=en
Philosophically, I think that the process of learning - whether by a human or simulacrom - should be protected. That is, if I write a book, I don't need to seek the permission or pay the authors of every book I've ever read. To me, this is the only sane result for a non-dualist materialist who believes neural networks are in principle isomorphic to human minds.
As a matter of law, I believe it will have to be determined on the case law level some point. I'm not a lawyer and this is not legal advice.
(Not mine) https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=48KtJtDqkaM
https://arxiv.org/pdf/2007.08509.pdf
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlCh6-2NfSg
Still impressive!
I anticipate potential use-cases ('level/scene generation' in game content creation) where this actually turns out to be the most valuable aspect of the output. I can't imagine that it would be too much of a stretch to 'start with a photo' as a 'seed' and use it to create a 3D world. My only concern would be 'sameyness tendency', in other words, the problem would be that a variety of seed photos of similar kinds of scenes would end up creating worlds that were too similar to one another to make 'still photo to fly-through movie to navigable detailed 3D world' a sufficiently 'creative' source of sufficiently differentiated new game worlds (or of sufficiently differentiated new fly-through movies). I suspect this could all be fixed by 'differentiator algorithms' interfering with the key variables of the 'refinement' process, as well as broadening and continually adding to the range of movies in the training data.
There's a few ways I see procedural generation as worse than limited [human] curated modelling - you lose the very careful balance, the iterated architecting to enhance game play, you also lose the commonality of experience across players, and if the game is often played you lose an aspect of the player's ability to become expert at the game.
It's natural that game companies will use lots of procedural/ML generation of game aspects; but it's probably going to be "if you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail".
Television had a certain manner of aiding societal cohesion when we only had a few channels (3 when I was little). That meant lots of commonality of experience. It seems [some] games could go the same way - players getting such vast differences of experience that we lose some of that shared experience that binds people together.
Ultimately, a future of us all living in our own entirely unique VR realty seems like some version of hell.
I am guessing this will be used in Google Maps Street View?