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Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by AnIdiotOnTheNet on Tuesday February 02, 2021 @11:28AM (#26002982)
Yeah seriously. The Gnome project is go-to example of non-ad-driven user-hostile FOSS software development.
Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by cycloptic on Tuesday February 02, 2021 @12:35PM (#26003904)
I have no idea why it has become so common on here to dog on GNOME for being "user-hostile" because they targeted a different kind of user than the average HN engineer/startup person. You can use one of the "GNOME 2 revival" type desktop environments if that's your fancy.
Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by michaelmrose on Wednesday February 03, 2021 @03:42AM (#26011794)
They produce bad software with a bad interface based on a bad theory of how people use things and when people critique their bad software they give bad reasons, argued badly, with a bad attitude and in bad faith to boot.

It truly needs its own fractal of bad design essay save it would have to a farce in 7 parts.

To say that they targeted a different kind of user is insufficiently descriptive. 3.0 was the beginning of ticking off the users they actually had in order to target users they wish they could get with a total package that such users could never encounter in a million years because joe average wasn't installing Linux in 2011 regardless of how simple you made the interface.

9 years later the Linux user base is virtually unchanged and gnome 3 is no longer horrifying as 9 years of labor have rendered it modestly acceptable after the worst ideas were put off or mitigated.

If you spent 300k building a hovel where the roof fell in quarterly and you after much consternation and a decade of work figured out how to keep the roof mostly in place most of the time I would pretty much expect such a project to be the go to horror story among home builders in the neighborhood.

This isn't meanness its just honesty.

Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by Miraste on Tuesday February 02, 2021 @01:00PM (#26004290)
That's their justification, but put a non-technical user in front of a gnome system and you will find nothing but confusion. It doesn't operate like any other OS GUI, nor is it intuitive or discoverable, nor does it have feature parity. They must be designing gnome for someone, but I don't know who.
Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by cycloptic on Tuesday February 02, 2021 @01:06PM (#26004350)
I don't know, last time I tried stock Ubuntu I found it to be pretty similar to current macOS with the launchpad and mission control. In any case, the answer to those problems you're describing would be more and more breaking changes, not less.
Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by type0 on Tuesday February 02, 2021 @05:28PM (#26007846)
Ubuntu ships with a patched version of GNOME, default experience is completely different.
Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by Macha on Tuesday February 02, 2021 @12:47PM (#26004100)
Because the user they were hostile to were the users that had been until then the majority of Gnome's users. It may be a good business move to ditch your existing userbase in favour of a potential larger one but the userbase you've moved on from have no obligation to be happy about that
Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by cycloptic on Tuesday February 02, 2021 @12:57PM (#26004247)
I don't expect the community to be happy, I would say I more expect a community of engineers to be realistic. The ship has unfortunately sailed long ago and it's not coming back.
Re:I'm tired of this anti-Wayland horseshit by type0 on Tuesday February 02, 2021 @05:32PM (#26007900)
> because they targeted a different kind of user than the average HN engineer/startup person.

It is not, sometimes GNOME devs even say outright that the project is for their peers and those who share their vision. They do their testing on other GNOME aficionados. In the days of Unity, Canonical did some of their user testing on regular people, those days are long gone.