News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by manfredo on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:05PM (#25649526)
The sanctions are meant to put pressure on Iran to stop development of nuclear weapons. A regime change is not a likely consequence of sanctions, it's much more likely that the Iranian government looks at the economic toll of it's choice to pursue nuclear weapons development and decides to change course. Without a doubt these sanctions cause much misery - the bulk of it inflicted on everyday people who are not decision makers in the country. But allowing a country that regularly threatens to wipe other countries off the map to develop nuclear weapons stands to create orders of magnitude more misery than economic sanctions.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by emilsedgh on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:12PM (#25649626)
I personally full supported Obama's sanctions on Iran. They had a purpose (Stop Iran's nuclear program) that made sense and was achievable.

And they achieved it. All European countries and united nations and Obama administration confirmed that Iran was committed to the nuclear deal.Even current and former Israel generals wrote letters to show support for Obama's deal with Iran which stopped Iranian nuclear program.

What the current administration wants is much much more than nuclear concerns [0]. They are basically telling the Islamic Republic to shoot itself in the head. Or face sanctions.

Of course they pick sanctions.

[0] https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/5/21/mike-pompeo-speech-...

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by manfredo on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:24PM (#25649796)
Can you elaborate on how this amounts to telling Iran to "shoot itself in the head"? The 12 demands as per your article are:

> Declare to the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) a full account of the prior military dimensions of its nuclear programme and permanently and verifiably abandon such work in perpetuity.

> Stop enrichment and never pursue plutonium reprocessing, including closing its heavy water reactor.

> Provide the IAEA with unqualified access to all sites throughout the entire country.

> End its proliferation of ballistic missiles and halt further launching or development of nuclear-capable missile systems.

> Release all US citizens as well as citizens of US partners and allies.

> End support to Middle East “terrorist” groups, including Hezbollah, Hamas and Islamic Jihad.

> Respect the sovereignty of the Iraqi government and permit the disarming, demobilisation and reintegration of Shia militias.

> End its military support for the Houthi rebels and work towards a peaceful, political settlement in Yemen.

> Withdraw all forces under Iran’s command throughout the entirety of Syria.

> End support for the Taliban and other “terrorists” in Afghanistan and the region and cease harbouring senior al-Qaeda leaders.

> End the Islamic Revolutionary Guard corps-linked Quds Force’s support for “terrorists” and “militant” partners around the world.

> End its threatening behaviour against its neighbours, many of whom are US allies, including its threats to destroy Israel and its firing of missiles at Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates, and threats to international shipping and destructive cyberattacks.

This really amounts to 3 things:

1. Stop pursuing nuclear weapons development, and actually give inspectors the ability to verify that Iran is staying true to it's word.

2. Stop supporting terrorist organizations, and other proxy wars.

3. Stop threatening to destroy Saudi Arabia, Israel, and other countries.

Sure, demanding the release of US citizens is superfluous and unnecessary. But how does this amount to telling Iran to "shoot itself in the head"? How would fulfilling these 12 points kill Iran? How does Iran somehow end up dying if it stops fighting proxy wars in Yemen and Iraq?

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by Daho0n on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @03:18PM (#25650470)
How do you stop sanctions if you already follow the demands put in front of you? The reason the world isn't on the US side against Iran wholly as it were in the beginning of the sanctions is that Iran did live up to the demands.... and then the demands were changed. The US broke the deal, not the Iranians.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by manfredo on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @03:43PM (#25650749)
You stop the sanctions by meeting the new demands. The US decided the original deal did not offer inspectors enough leeway to ensure Iran was actually halting nuclear weapons development, and so it added more stringent inspection requirements. Adopting or walking away from a deal is a mutual decision. Yes, the US decided to put new terms on the deal. Iran could have accepted adding real enforcement mechanisms to the deal and ended the sanctions, but decided otherwise.

This thread is being rate limited. The commenter below is incorrect. The post deal demands included restrictions on nuclear-capable ballistic missiles, too, but they also included changes to increase the access of inspectors. This was a substantial part of why the original deal was rejected, the new administration believed the original restricted inspectors to the extent that Iran could still develop nuclear weapons in secrecy.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by joshuaissac on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @04:30PM (#25651375)
The existing deal already has enforcement mechanisms under Article 37. If Iran violates the deal, the UNSC sanctions are reinstated by the P5+1. If the P5+1 violate the deal, Iran scales back its own commitments. All of this is in the existing treaty.

And there is no guarantee that meeting the new demands would result in sanctions stopping, rather than in more sanctions and demands.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by emilsedgh on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @04:11PM (#25651116)
United States' post-deal demands were not nuclear. They were regarding Iran's missile program.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by golemiprague on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:51PM (#25650115)
The sanctions are not to prevent nuclear development, the Israelis are not stupid and they know Iran can develop it sanctions or not, it will be dealt with a cold war strategies as it always was.

The sanctions are to weaken its non nuclear aspirations, their push to create an Iranian crescent from Iran to Lebanon making many people life miserable on the way, people who don't want them in the region.

It's a country that clearly state their will to destroy Israel and their militias in Lebanon actively attacked Israel even though there is no border conflict there right now and the two countries could set up a peace agreement easily. But it is not only the Israelis that don't want them there, the majority Sunni and Christians in Syria, Lebanon and Iraq also not happy with the Iranian push, hence the joy everybody had when Trump killed Sulemeini.

Obama was an idiot who bought into the meme of "preventing nuclear", he didn't understand the middle east at all and during his time the middle east was in flames with millions of deaths and refugees. He didn't support the demonstrations in Iran when they happened, just stood there looking like a the lame useless president that he was with his useless speeches.

Trump brought quiet and peace and he did it with almost no cost of life, just by having a knack to dealing with crazy leaders of the region which is more aligned with his natural craziness and line of thinking, and with a bit of Kushner brilliance behind the scenes.

I just hope Biden is not as stupid as Obama and will keep the pressure on Iran, got a feeling he is a bit more experienced and realist so I am hopeful he will understand what's going on.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by yyyk on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @03:37PM (#25650688)
The problem is the cost of the deal is too high and the benefit too low.

The Iran deal is actually rather simple in concept. Iran temporarily suspends certain nuclear activities (not all of them - for example, researching enrichment is fine). In return, Iran gets an economic boost and a permit to do whatever it wants, like supporting terrorists or mass murdering Syrians or trying to destroy Israel.

The latter part may surprise you, but it's obvious when one thinks about it. What is the West allowed to do when Iran commits those things? It's not economic sanctions, since removing sanctions and then placing them on again for different reasons would leave Iran no reason to comply with the nuclear deal. And of course, war is undesireable (the entire point of the deal was to avoid war). So Iran can do whatever, and if the West does anything serious, well, nukes.

The rest of the ME isn't going to meekly submit to Iran. Worse, Iran can't finance its holdings (Iran requires weak governments in order to hold Iraq and Lebanon, but that means no investments). That means things get done in the ME way, which already leads to mass amounts of refugees.

Iran's involvement in Syria directly led to Brexit (Leave would have lost without an immigration crisis on) and played a key role in Trump getting elected (Is it a surprise the most anti-immigration R candidate won the primary given that background? Didn't Trump end up hiring Cambridge Analytica, which would have never happened absent Brexit?). If it weren't for the deal, maybe the US would have done something about Syria and we'd have avoided all that. If Iranian destablization of ME restarts under Biden, the result may well be Trump mk2.

I do not believe this is an acceptable price for temporary restrictions.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by softwhale on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @04:47PM (#25651594)
> Iran's involvement in Syria directly led to Brexit

It's appalling how you (even partially(?)) blame Iran for Brexit. The US decided to support Syrian rebels (of whom mostly turned out to become or move to ISIS). Syria is a secular state, whether you like to believe this or not. The Russians and Iranians were legitimately asked by its officials to help support the Syrian army to tackle the terrorists. Yet, the US and its allies financed/armed so called rebels that made a disaster of the country. Remember McCain's visits and photographs back in 2011? Why is the US even STILL there?! I can not think of a single country in the ME that turned out to become better after the US started meddling in its elections/government - ironically, including the one which you are currently blaming.

Blame the incompetence of Brexit on the people who advocated for it and who like to ignore/dismiss facts.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by yyyk on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @05:00PM (#25651739)
Assad runs a mass-scale torture state. Iran supported Assad from the beginning, without it he wouldn't have survived to 2015. The result of Assad's butchery is a mass displacement of Syrians, ergo refugee crisis, ergo Leave victory in Brexit referendum.

If the US was ever serious about not letting Assad and Iran get away with it all that wouldn't have happened, and there wouldn't have been Brexit. The US's decision to not get involved against Assad (they're there for ISIS I remind you) had a far worse result in human lives and geopolitical impact than any of the US's 'meddling'.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by softwhale on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @05:18PM (#25651978)
> The US's decision to not get involved against Assad (they're there for ISIS I remind you)

So is Iran? Mind you: the weapons these rebels aka ISIS had were mostly/directly provided by the US and its allies! No official from Syria asked the US to be there! Imagine if Iran would deploy troops tomorrow in Washington to endorse groups to tackle the existing government. The real danger is supporting regimes that endorse Salafist/Wahabist Islam, which the West likes to do. This hypocrisy of the West is fascinating. I think that could have somehow played a role in Brexit...

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by yyyk on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @05:24PM (#25652035)
Iran supported Assad since before ISIS existed. In fact their operations were almost all directed against the rebels but never against ISIS.

Iran supports Assad for a link with Lebanon and threatening Israel, and if a lot of Sunnis are forced by Assad to migrate, well, that's more like a bonus for them, since it destablizes the West.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by bloak on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @05:07PM (#25651858)
The goal of US foreign policy is world domination. The sanctions on Iran may well contribute to that goal. However, from the point of view of what's good for mankind generally I'm not sure it wouldn't be a good thing for Iran to have nuclear weapons. It would discourage other countries from attacking Iran and it would also give other countries an incentive not to destabilise Iran. There would, of course, be some obvious disadvantages - so it's not an easy (hypothetical) decision - but Iran would probably be a safer and better custodian of nuclear weapons than at least one other country that already has them so I certainly don't think it would be a terribly bad thing for Iran to join the club.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by macspoofing on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @05:32PM (#25652142)
>The goal of US foreign policy is world domination.

US is a global superpower and they are the creators of the modern global order of free trade and democracy (it isn't a coincidence that there has been meteoric rise in the number of democracies since WW2, and end of Cold War). If that's 'world domination' then OK. But to be clear, if it wasn't them, another global superpower would fill the vacuum. In the 20th century, that would have been the Soviets. In the 21st, it may be China. Is that better?

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by austincheney on Wednesday January 06, 2021 @02:39AM (#25655464)
The goal of US foreign policy is defense in depth via diplomacy and alliances, which hasn't significantly changed in the past 100 years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_in_depth

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by dvdhnt on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:10PM (#25649589)
When has that worked? The same countries have been sanctioned over and over without successfully alleviating tense relations.

Why would a government who doesn't care about its population look at the suffering of those people and change course? Are we naive enough to believe that the Iranian elite aren't circumventing these sanctions personally?

Finally, why? Like, after hundreds of years of imperialism and political interference, I've yet to hear a compelling case to continue doing these things given they've done nothing but push us further away from each other and closer to a climate-crisis, dystopian nightmare.

We need cooperation not blackmail.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by manfredo on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:20PM (#25649746)
South Africa, among others, have had large changes in direction prompted through sanctions. Cuba has also gradually allowed more economic freedom over the past decade.

I agree, cooperation is what is needed not blackmail. That's what the sanctions are doing: if Iran wants to cooperate economically with other countries, it needs to stop trying to blackmail other countries with threats of nuclear strikes.

As far as why, Iran regularly threatens to wipe other Middle Eastern countries off the map - including the nuclear armed Israel, which would easily trigger a nuclear war in the middle east. The simple reality is that there is not an equivalency between the possession of nuclear weapons by China, Russia, NATO, versus North Korea and Iran. The former don't go around threatening to wipe other countries off the map on a regular basis. Nor does Israel, they don't even officially acknowledge nuclear capacities. The latter do, and in North Korea's case it has created one of the most infamous geopolitical catastrophes of the 20th century. And Iran stands to become a much larger North Korea in a much more volatile part of the world.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by publicola1990 on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:27PM (#25649827)
Israel does go around bombing things in other countries.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by manfredo on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:48PM (#25650071)
A couple strikes per month [1] in response to Syrian missile batteries shooting down Israeli planes is not particularly comparable with threatening to wipe a country off the map. Most of these aren't even direct attacks, Iranians are killed in the crossfire because they're supporting proxy fighters in Syria.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Israel_conflict_d...

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by Daho0n on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @03:23PM (#25650516)
You cannot seriously not add attacks on Palestinians. It would be a country too if it weren't occupied and crushed completely. More and more acknowledge this every year.

Then there's all the hits on people by Mossad.

Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by dotancohen on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @03:08PM (#25650335)
As do China, Russia, and NATO. Why single out Israel?
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by core-questions on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @04:23PM (#25651261)
America does not pay for China and Russia's bombs, at the very least; but something tells me you already knew that.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by joelbluminator on Wednesday January 06, 2021 @08:51AM (#25657686)
America bombed the crap out of many countries throughout history. I mean wtf was Vietnam all about? Iraq didn't look that good either.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by core-questions on Wednesday January 06, 2021 @03:10PM (#25661681)
Cool, yeah, more bad stuff. Doesn't cancel out what I was talking about at all - this is just a standard "whataboutism". I'd like to see an end to all bombing everywhere. It's easier as a Canadian to hold this perspective, of course; I don't have to condone or defend the past evils of America at all.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by joelbluminator on Thursday January 07, 2021 @06:56PM (#25679413)
Whataboutism has its merit in this instance. If the U.S wants to show its moral superioriry it needs to actually try becoming morally superior. Which I am not sure it is. Otherwise it reeks of hypocrisy and people rightly suspects most Americans do not care about China's morals at all but about losing their hegemony to China. So its easy to become a cynic when seeing these debates.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by dotancohen on Thursday January 07, 2021 @08:53AM (#25670989)
So the issue is not the people suffering, but rather who's paying. Got it.
Re:GitHub is fully available in Iran by wazoox on Tuesday January 05, 2021 @02:12PM (#25649620)
There was a deal, it was working, and the US (well, Trump) unilaterally broke out of it (as usual). Your lame excuses really are disgusting.