Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most Isolated Cities on Earth

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by ryandrake on Friday January 01, 2021 @08:23PM (#25609264)

After the "Ghost Road" story on HN a few days ago [1], out of boredom and curiosity, I did a little browsing around online maps in Russia and noticed there really aren't any major roads at all connecting northern/eastern Siberia to the rest of Russia--unless Google Maps and Openstreetmap are woefully incomplete, which is possible. It seems so alien to my pampered US sensibilities, all spoiled by our glorious interstate highway system and regional State highways. How can the vast majority of a country's small towns and land area be not even remotely accessible by so much as a dirt road?? I get that few people live there, but the ones that do, how do they go anywhere else in Russia?

In the US, most of the country is at most 5-6 miles from some kind of road. Maybe there are spots in Yellowstone that are 20 miles from a road, but thats orders of magnitude less remote than what Maps depicts about Siberia!

1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25574180

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by monkeybutton on Friday January 01, 2021 @08:31PM (#25609313)

Perhaps a better comparison to Russia would be Canada rather than the United States? Similarly much of the north isn't accessible by roads year round or at all. It either doesn't make sense based on the population of the towns or is very impractical over the hash terrain.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by pomian on Friday January 01, 2021 @08:51PM (#25609442)

Canada, and especially "the North", has many towns, only accessible by winter; ice roads. After freeze up, they are plowed, and maintained. After break up in the spring, those towns are only re supplied with groceries, medical supplies, traveling doctors, etc. By airplane. There is a lot of pressure to stock up in the winter. The region is covered by muskeg ( swamp), rivers and lakes. Winter is the only time many places are accessible. This also is true for mineral, oil and gas exploration. Winter is a blessing. Global warming, will give rise to many interesting questions about accessibility. See Norman Wells, Tuktoyaktuk, and Aklavik. New highways, old ice roads.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by jacquesm on Saturday January 02, 2021 @04:57AM (#25611606)

Global warming will change where we live for very large numbers of people. The problem is that the change is slow enough for people to ignore it.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by fruit_snack on Sunday January 03, 2021 @01:09AM (#25619914)

Hmm sounds like real estate in Siberia predicting global warming to warm it up would be a nice multi generational investment

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by Breza on Sunday January 03, 2021 @10:16PM (#25627606)

The book Windfall details all sorts of ways that people are trying to make a buck off of climate change. Good book if you want to see a different side of the issue.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/18079772-windfall

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by boringg on Friday January 01, 2021 @09:19PM (#25609639)

Winter is a blessing for transportation and for O&G activity. The incredibly short days and cold nights are definitively not a blessing for the the humans living up there.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by wyck on Friday January 01, 2021 @09:45PM (#25609828)

Yes, but you will take cold winter any day over the summer bugs. Lot of water and enough black flies and mosquitoes to drive fully grown moose insane.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by nkozyra on Friday January 01, 2021 @08:44PM (#25609393)

I think it could also be argued that the proliferation of roads and highways in the United States led to more mobility for citizens. A chicken-and-egg question, for sure, but people are unlikely to move to a place that is largely inaccessible.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by IndrekR on Friday January 01, 2021 @08:35PM (#25609338)

> I get that few people live there, but the ones that do, how do they go anywhere else in Russia?

They do not; and this surprised me a lot when I found out. There still today is a very large number of people who have not travelled outside 50 km/30 miles radius from their home during their entire life.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by codesnik on Saturday January 02, 2021 @05:41AM (#25611864)

meanwhile I've heard siberia is also famous for considering just a normal business a 300 km fishing trip in all-terrain vehicles via something barely resembling a road.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by ahthat on Saturday January 02, 2021 @03:41AM (#25611333)

Don’t forget Alaska. There are roads connecting the Yukon to Fairbanks and Anchorage, and the unpaved Dalton Highway connecting Fairbanks to the North Slope, but there are no roads connecting Fairbanks to the western part of the state at all. Most of the state and its towns and villages are accessible only via aircraft. There are no roads to Juneau, the state capital, for instance. Hawaii has an interstate on the island of Oahu, but Alaska has no interstate highways to speak of. It is a VERY undeveloped state.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by xxpor on Saturday January 02, 2021 @09:19AM (#25612973)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Interstate_Highways_...

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by asats on Friday January 01, 2021 @08:49PM (#25609430)

People don't travel much in those places. During the summer a lot of them are almost completely cut off, though there's often small aviation flights from some of them, so people can get out in emegencies. The situation is a lot better during the winter with https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%97%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%BD%D0%B8... (ice roads), that's how and when most travel/supply trips happen.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by na85 on Saturday January 02, 2021 @03:11AM (#25611231)

I live in Canada and our northern regions are mostly unconnected by roads. A lot of that terrain is muskeg and swamp, or else it's Canadian Shield. I was once quoted a figure for roadbuilding up there at upwards of $1 million per km, so for you I guess that'd be $1.3M per mile.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by grecy on Friday January 01, 2021 @09:54PM (#25609888)

Fun Fact, in the lower 48 it's impossible to get more than 115 miles from a McDonalds!

Yep, anywhere! http://www.datapointed.net/2010/09/distance-to-nearest-mcdon...

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by bamboleo on Saturday January 02, 2021 @12:55AM (#25610758)

That’s still an awful lot of miles to travel for that. If I remember correctly Subway has the most locations so probably you can get better food by driving less.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by LargoLasskhyfv on Saturday January 02, 2021 @04:28AM (#25611481)

Debatable. See https://www.bbc.com/news/business-54370056

Though I have to confess to like their chicken teriyaki thing from time to time, customized to extra hot ;-)

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by cpursley on Saturday January 02, 2021 @04:30AM (#25611488)

Subway being better food than McDonald's is debatable (considering Subway bread is pure sugar and you can get a fresh chicken salad at McDonald's).

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by ghaff on Saturday January 02, 2021 @09:18AM (#25612968)

As someone who likes a good Italian sub now and then, I'm always a bit impressed just how bad Subway can make its food. I can at least find something I'm OK with at McDonald's (though I probably won't eat a burger). Not Subway.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by seized on Saturday January 02, 2021 @11:55AM (#25614124)

Quiznos has gone far downhill too.

Firehouse Subs and Jimmy John's are amazing sandwiches but far less available.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by 082349872349872 on Saturday January 02, 2021 @06:07AM (#25611973)

For a historical example of US "rugged individualism", see the lengths Huey P. Long went to just to convince the people of Louisiana that paving roads at public expense wasn't some kind of socialist waste of money.

(Long was clearly a demagogue, but on this particular point I have to agree with him that a reasonable road network is a public good)

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by Breza on Sunday January 03, 2021 @10:19PM (#25627617)

Every bad leader had good policies. I was surprised to hear a member of a tribe in New Mexico telling me great things about Nixon.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by publicola1990 on Saturday January 02, 2021 @10:52AM (#25613585)

There is a major road gap between North America and South America as well: the Darien Gap.

Last I heard there was no plans afoot to build a road across it.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by LargoLasskhyfv on Saturday January 02, 2021 @04:18AM (#25611447)

Yah, well. Try parts of Alaska? Same terrain & climate.

[ Parent | on HN ]

Re:Crossing 2000 Miles of Siberia to Reach One of the Most I... by asdff on Saturday January 02, 2021 @12:59AM (#25610775)

There are places in Alaska only accessible by bush plane too.

[ Parent | on HN ]