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Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by neither_color on Thursday December 24, 2020 @03:00AM (#25525821)
The US has the largest immigrant population in the world and one of the highest immigration rates among developed countries. I resent how casually blatantly false anti-US comments like this get voted up without any data to back them up, almost like it's a fad to talk-down America. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_the_United_Stat...
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by ohmaigad on Thursday December 24, 2020 @04:33AM (#25526179)
Using absolute numbers probably isn't the smartest idea. Canada has more immigrants per population than USA.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by brobdingnagians on Thursday December 24, 2020 @04:52AM (#25526243)
And that is their decision. I think it is best for each country to decide for themselves, based on their culture, objectives, history, and values. France has a way of doing it, Canada has a way of doing it, China has a way of doing it, and the US has a way of doing it. One size fits all is least applicable when it comes to nation states.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by thefounder on Thursday December 24, 2020 @05:26AM (#25526404)
So a country made of and built by immigrants doesn't want immigrants anymore. I think that culture has a name: hypocrisy
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by neither_color on Thursday December 24, 2020 @12:05PM (#25529225)
This is a motte and bailey fallacy and doesnt even merit a response. Why dont you start with a good faith argument for how the US is anti immigrant, since the numbers clearly dont agree with that statement.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by bruceb on Thursday December 24, 2020 @05:59AM (#25526519)
There have always been limits to immigration. Almost no one is saying no immigration. Needs change. What the country needs now might not be the same as 150 years ago.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by tzs on Thursday December 24, 2020 @06:39AM (#25526690)
> There have always been limits to immigration.

The first limit on immigration in the US was the Page act in 1875, which restricted immigration of Chinese women.

Before that there were no limits.

Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by thefounder on Thursday December 24, 2020 @08:43AM (#25527354)
>> What the country needs now might not be the same as 150 years ago.

Yeah, it seems now it needs to cage children to deter their pesky parents from seeking opportunities in the land of opportunity.

Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by UncleMeat on Thursday December 24, 2020 @11:26AM (#25528856)
And that decision can be criticized.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by roenxi on Thursday December 24, 2020 @05:46AM (#25526481)
Absolute numbers seems legitimate. The US per capita immigration rate is largely the result of the high absolute number of immigrants taken in over US history.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by Retric on Thursday December 24, 2020 @06:09AM (#25526560)
Absolute numbers are heavily dependent on country size and most countries are tiny. Vatican City at the extreme end is formed 100% from immigrants, but has a tiny and self limiting population.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by roenxi on Thursday December 24, 2020 @07:14AM (#25526863)
The Vatican is not a migrant friendly destination, despite being made up entirely of immigrants. If I were to try and migrate I would try to migrate to the States. All of a few hundred people worldwide are trying to migrate to the Vatican.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by Retric on Thursday December 24, 2020 @09:10AM (#25527550)
I suspect far more than a few hundred people are aiming to become Pope let alone immigrate to Vatican City. Only a few can make it.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by neither_color on Thursday December 24, 2020 @12:00PM (#25529180)
We're still one of the highest. We dont need to be #1 per capita to prove we're not "anti immigrant."
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by randmeerkat on Thursday December 24, 2020 @04:55AM (#25526261)
It is a fad to talk-down America. It’s soft power in politics, something the US has been losing for many years now. Anti-Americanism and its rise is something extensively covered in academia over the past two decades, this is just 2020: https://scholar.google.com/scholar?as_ylo=2020&q=anti+americ...
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by RobertoG on Thursday December 24, 2020 @05:19AM (#25526361)
I think there are two factors to this "fad":

one is that USA for being the world superpower and through their media monopoly is always in the spotlight.

The second is that USA spend too much time saying how wonderful they are (that if you look to history with a little objectivity is not so wonderful). Reaction to this is almost inevitable.

I would like to present a trivial recent example: as you know, USA retired from the climate Paris agreement and, in general, is not doing so much like other nations despite being the worst in per capita terms.

Well, it seems that the new president want to go back to the Paris agreements and is framing it like "going back to led the world" in climate change. Going back to led the world? really?

I know, I know, this a sentence for internal consumption but still, how do you think it sounds in other countries?

I didn't touch the little fact of invasions of third countries and military bases all around the world.

So, maybe there is something to this fad? Maybe take it like feedback to correct a few things?

Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by 5560675260 on Thursday December 24, 2020 @07:06AM (#25526822)
> in general, is not doing so much like other nations despite being the worst in per capita terms.

Do you have sources to back any part of this statement? It would be surprising to see US doing less and being worth that, for example, Germany and its coal or China and its industrial complex. Otherwise it seems to be another example of "blatantly false anti-US comments like this get voted up without any data to back them up".

Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by RobertoG on Thursday December 24, 2020 @07:37AM (#25526973)
Actually I have to correct that because the USA is not the worst per capita (my apologies), but it's up there with the top worst (Canada, Australia, Saudi Arabia and a bunch of smaller countries) and, of course, more important because of the size of its population (1).

It seems that what it's in dispute is the "not doing so much like other nations". I would say there are two ways to look at it: pledges and historical data.

I don't think is necessary to demonstrate that the USA current pledges are below the Paris agreement countries.

For historical I just will take 2019 that was a specially good year for USA CO2 reductions.

from https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/us-leads-world-reducing-co...

>>"It’s true that, according to the IEA’s February 2020 report, the U.S. achieved a greater absolute reduction in CO2 emissions than any other country, in 2019. However, claims that the U.S. therefore “led the entire world” or was a “global leader” in CO2 emissions were belied by the fact that other countries (including Germany, Japan, and likely others) achieved a superior rate of reduction in CO2 emissions. Although not a country, the European Union achieved both a larger absolute reduction and a greater rate of reduction in CO2 emissions than the US did. "

(1) - https://www.worldometers.info/co2-emissions/co2-emissions-by...

Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by onion2k on Thursday December 24, 2020 @05:34AM (#25526435)
Historically America has been very pro-immigration. Very recently that appears to have changed (that's the view from the outside at least).
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by conanbatt on Thursday December 24, 2020 @03:00AM (#25525825)
That is in spite of immigration policy, not because of it.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by neither_color on Thursday December 24, 2020 @03:21AM (#25525914)
Which policy? The latest H1-B bill which lifts per-country caps passed unanimously in the senate and with a strong majority in the house. https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/1044 Certainly different people will have different opinions on what the "right" number of immigrants is but this is not an anti-immigrant country.
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by wahern on Thursday December 24, 2020 @03:55AM (#25526025)
That's because it's designed to let in more rich Asians and less poor Latin Americans and Africans.

In terms of popular political support I would say that the United States is very anti-immigrant, and has been for a very long time. The reason the U.S. continues to let in so many immigrants is because of business interests, which have always held considerable political power. And the reason the U.S. has such diversity of immigrants is because of the peculiarity of our laws (e.g. by promoting so-called chain migration, a term Trump has turned into a pejorative), which have largely stayed the same because of inertia and political deadlock, but as you pointed out this is likely to change soon.

Also, the U.S. is no longer unique in terms of its large foreign born population. The U.K., for example, has roughly the same percentage. Brexit is no coincidence. Ditto for Germany. Though AFAIU German anti-immigration sentiment is mostly focused on immigrants from outside the E.U. (e.g. Turkey), whereas a large part of the sentiment in the U.K. is focused on Eastern European immigrants. Thus Angela Merkel has managed to placate voters by tacitly supporting harsher restrictions at the E.U. border, the short-lived Syrian influx notwithstanding. Brexit was driven in part by, e.g., people being pissed at low-wage Polish migrants.

I'll agree that the U.S. isn't worse than other countries. And I suppose our history as being a melting pot relatively unique unto the world is still worth something. (Though many parts of Latin America also saw similar migration flows at the turn of the 18th century. There are still German speaking towns in Brazil, Welsh speaking towns in Argentina, and a curious number of ethnic Japanese all over South America.) But we don't really stand out anymore one way or the other.

Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by op03 on Thursday December 24, 2020 @04:45AM (#25526218)
Well lets add a nothing is obvious layer to this cake - https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/12/20/us/politics/e...
Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by conanbatt on Thursday December 24, 2020 @02:34PM (#25530652)
Immigration cap? Without a cap on H1B the US would have 10 or 50 times the level of incoming immigrants.

Plus H1B is limited to having degrees (or a lot of work experience) in a small subset of occupations.

The US could bring over 1 million doctors in one year if it were legal.

H1B is only one specific case of immigration: generally speaking the developed world allows for unconstrained immigration if you have a job offer. Americans are particularly restricted in hiring foreigners, which is also one reason why it has so much illegal immigration.

Re:Covid: France rewards frontline immigrant workers with ci... by ithastobe on Thursday December 24, 2020 @06:56AM (#25526765)
This bill failed to pass in the house eventually after senate passed the initial house bill with amendments.