News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by mrfusion on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:32PM (#24534952)
The liberties protected by the Constitution are not fair-weather freedoms -- in place when times are good but able to be cast aside in times of trouble. There is no question that this country has faced, and will face, emergencies of every sort, but the solution to a national crisis can never be permitted to supersede the commitment to individual liberty that stands as the foundation of the American experiment. The constitution cannot accept the concept of a 'new normal' where the basic liberties of the people can be subordinated to open-ended emergency mitigation measures

- U.S. District Judge William Stickman declaring PA's lockdown orders unconstitutional

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by sjg007 on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:44PM (#24535051)
Except he is wrong. The Supreme Court has ruled that such lockdowns are indeed constitutional and the States have the right to enforce them unless Congress intervenes.
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by DuskStar on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:48PM (#24535078)
When did the Supreme Court rule that?

And why the hell would Congress be able to overrule states on something like this? What torturous reading of the Commerce Clause gives Congress the power to forbid lockdowns?

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by inthewoods on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:40PM (#24535625)
https://www.spotlightpa.org/news/2020/09/pa-coronavirus-orde...

"U.S. Supreme Court Chief Justice John Roberts, in a similar case out of California related to pandemic restrictions on religious gatherings, wrote in May that elected officials should be allowed latitude when acting in areas “fraught with medical and scientific uncertainties” and should not be subject to second-guessing by an “unelected federal judiciary.”

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by DuskStar on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:49PM (#24535720)
And wasn't that addressed in Stickman's ruling? There's a difference between "something that we can allow in an emergency" and "something that has been going on for 6 months and legally continues forever", like the situation in PA.

Further, if there are medical and scientific uncertainties... Erring on the side of constitutional rights seems a LOT less potentially exploitable to me. If you think that something is so critical that you need to permanently remove rights to combat it... You should be able to back that up with incontrovertible evidence.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by just-juan-post on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:54PM (#24535141)
Could you please provide more information on this?

If this is true it may change my congress and senate votes from blue to red.

I won't vote in a presidential candidate that supports lockdowns "if the science supports it" and will make me wear a mask.

Can his party truly make my state do these things?

If so that's terrifying to me and there's no way I'm giving blue, the people I voted for all my life until this year, this type of power.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by azinman2 on Sunday September 20, 2020 @02:28PM (#24536097)
Can you explain why not wearing a mask is so important to you? I simply don’t understand this reaction. We already don’t let you go naked in the streets for a variety of reasons including public health, and masks are one of the major tools we have to combat this virus. We already require standards for restaurants otherwise they get shut down due to public health concerns (there’s no freedom allowed to serve rotting meat and make others sick). Countries with high mask compliance like S Korea and Hong Kong have had far fewer cases, and when they, they limit the spread better. We’ve already lost 200k Americans in roughly 6 months, with millions more to lose if we remove all restrictions and no one wears a mask. Why does public health get such a low priority for you? And why does your freedom allow you to spread a deadly virus to me, where I have no say in it?
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by rm_-rf_slash on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:05PM (#24535262)
Do you wear seatbelts?
[dead]
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by bbarn on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:14PM (#24535339)
I think you should start with the Media and freedom of speech. They've done more harm than all of those things in the last few decades.
[dead]
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by just-juan-post on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:44PM (#24535671)
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by liability on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:53PM (#24535761)
Oh man, you just made my day. Thank you for this.
[dead]
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by dang on Monday September 21, 2020 @01:42AM (#24540186)
Please don't break the site guidelines like that. Seriously not cool.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by Grimm1 on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:17PM (#24535379)
Sounds good to me let's get rid of alcohol the US has a really unhealthy relationship with it anyway, let's do it.

Lockdown protects the public health and has long standing precedent. https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/197/11

Just come out and say you're a selfish person who doesn't care if they harm people instead of hiding behind all of the pretense that it's restricting you too much.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by thekyle on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:31PM (#24535532)
Given that the last time the U.S. banned alcohol it was a total disaster causing thousands of deaths, and we now live in a time where public sentiment towards many currently illegal drugs becoming legal is positive. I don't expect prohibition to come back any time soon.
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by dredmorbius on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:43PM (#24535664)
Criminalising morality does tend to fare poorly. Setting responsibility at appropriate levels or behaviours (say, contributory negligence liability for drugs- or alcohol-based deaths or injury to the industry rather than individual users) might have merits.

Effective determination and points of control can be thorny.

[dead]
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by Grimm1 on Sunday September 20, 2020 @08:02PM (#24538489)
Sounds like the governments fault. I don't believe in allowing choices that go against the grain of common sense and utilitarian consequence.
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by jtbayly on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:49PM (#24535091)
Indefinitely such that it’s a new normal? No. Such is not constitutional.

Edit to respond to downvotes: Nor was it constitutional to institute sweeping metadata collection as a new normal in response to an emergency situation. Nor is it constitutional to make encryption illegal as the new normal because of an emergency. Etc.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by ntsplnkv2 on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:49PM (#24535093)
This will easily lose on appeal.
[dead]
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by dang on Sunday September 20, 2020 @05:10PM (#24537437)
Please don't take HN threads further into political flamewar.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by mensetmanusman on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:37PM (#24535599)
People have the ability and technology to protect themselves now. E.g. if you are wearing an N95 mask properly, the net effect on your risk profile if someone is wearing a cloth mask is <5%.
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by Izkata on Sunday September 20, 2020 @02:38PM (#24536194)
Well, flu season is a thing. We don't lock down every year...
[dead]
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by Clampower on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:20PM (#24535413)
This is such an ignorant comment that I've seen perpetuated around the internet recently, that I made an account just to respond to this.

HIV positive people on medication, cannot spread HIV. It's factually safer to have sex with an HIV positive person on meds, than a person who doesn't get tested and doesn't know their status.

This law exists so that HIV positive people who cannot spread the virus are not legally obligated to tell others they have the virus.

Please learn more about what it means to be HIV positive, and the discrimination that comes with it before making these horrible disparaging comments.

Undetectable = Uninfectable (u=u) maybe a good thing for you to Google.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by DuskStar on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:34PM (#24535569)
It's debatable. On the one hand, yes the most common case that the law applied to was "has HIV but virus loads are undetectable and thus risk of infection is nonexistent". On the other, removing that law means that someone who's off their meds with the intention of infecting others is now only guilty of a misdemeanor.

Personally, I'm still not sure how that doesn't count as rape by deception, but whatever.

In any case, I brought it up to compare to pandemic mask mandates. A "gay sex condom mandate" 30 or 40 years ago would have been incredibly effective at containing HIV (assuming it was actually followed), and HIV was at the time FAR more deadly than COVID-19. The fact that people consider one acceptable and one unthinkable is IMO interesting.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by throwaway20851 on Sunday September 20, 2020 @04:31PM (#24537150)
>HIV positive people on medication, cannot spread HIV

Absurdly false. Not everyone responds the same to medication, not everyone has the same health conditions, and not everyone begins treatment at the same time. Further to that, completely besides the point:

If you have a fatal disease that can only be kept at bay with powerful ARV's (that are often expensive and loaded with serious side effects), then you have the responsibility to inform those you potentially expose to it. Paramedics, doctors, dentists, sexual partners. Basic decency. You are KNOWINGLY making potentially life and death decisions for others by depriving them of information.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by mensetmanusman on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:44PM (#24535670)
“ But a defendant only violates Penal Code 120290 when he or she intentionally tries to infect a partner. So people will usually not be liable under a theory of negligence per se.

This means that in most cases, a plaintiff would have to prove actual negligence by a preponderance of the evidence.”

The law does not require that someone be on HIV medication, you have to prove ill intent or negligence.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by mensetmanusman on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:39PM (#24535620)
That’s a really good point. HIV is an interesting point, because we can not stop the spread, even after 50,000,000 deaths over the past few decades.

It’s objectively easier to stop HIV with coordinated effort than COVID, so therefore it is impossible to stop SARS-CoV-2 with the current population education/skill level.

Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by liability on Sunday September 20, 2020 @01:06PM (#24535274)
Evidently the government can force you to wear a mask but not a condom.
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by inthewoods on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:41PM (#24535016)
Not exactly shocking that a judge appointed by Trump would make such a statement and ruling.
[dead]
Re:Yelp: Local Economic Impact Report by inthewoods on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:55PM (#24535154)
I'd say he exerts fascist or "fundamental freedom" arguments to match his politics.