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Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by skocznymroczny on Thursday September 17, 2020 @09:06AM (#24504107)
Conservative doesn't really mean much anymore on its own. CDU might be considered conservative by Western European standards, but it's liberal by Eastern European standards.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by enaaem on Thursday September 17, 2020 @09:29AM (#24504338)
A lot of political labels have a different, often opposite, meaning in Europe compared to the US. A liberal in Europe refers to classical liberalism. We also have many political parties, so a liberal here is not necessary a christian conservative. Politics is more nuanced.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by vinay427 on Thursday September 17, 2020 @10:48AM (#24505273)
Did you reply to the right comment? What do US political designations have to do with European and EU politics? In any case, "a lot of political labels" implies several, and I'm not sure there are more than one or two that fit this description.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by sangnoir on Thursday September 17, 2020 @11:13AM (#24505616)
GP had cast "conservative" and "liberal" as mutually exclusive descriptions of the political spectrum: parent clarified that in Europe, those 2 terms mean the same thing. Mostly.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by cygx on Thursday September 17, 2020 @09:31PM (#24512015)
Probably closer to 'libertarian' in US parlance (laissez-faire economics, small government).
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by pbhjpbhj on Thursday September 17, 2020 @02:09PM (#24507969)
>" a liberal here is not necessary a christian conservative" //

They're pretty much opposite sides of the political spectrum in UK. Where are they anything other than that?

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by username90 on Friday September 18, 2020 @04:53AM (#24514493)
Liberal economic policies means low taxes, so in Sweden they are a right wing party. Why would they be anything but right wing?

Basically the most liberal party is for low taxes, for diversity and for secularism. If you want high taxes then you aren't a liberal.

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by wongarsu on Friday September 18, 2020 @06:41AM (#24515096)
In Germany the liberal party is the FDP, who are seen as centric (so between left and right). The left wants your taxes for social programs, the right wants your taxes for security, the FDP just wants lower taxes (but achieved by reducing bureaucracy and overheads, not by running a deficit like the US's political right).
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by skocznymroczny on Friday September 18, 2020 @03:06AM (#24513793)
I disagree. Perhaps it meant so in the past, but nowadays most commentators in Europe use liberal and left-wing almost interchangeably.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by username90 on Friday September 18, 2020 @04:51AM (#24514479)
Do they? Are you talking about UK? They don't do so in Sweden at least. UK is quite different from the rest of Europe on many points so they don't really count.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by lumost on Thursday September 17, 2020 @09:35AM (#24504407)
Are there any major pan-european parties? (that are taken seriously)
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by david_arcos on Thursday September 17, 2020 @10:25AM (#24504999)
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by read_if_gay_ on Thursday September 17, 2020 @12:57PM (#24507032)
> that are taken seriously
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by kazen44 on Thursday September 17, 2020 @01:39PM (#24507556)
the pirate party is actually seen as a serious political party in both european aswell as local/national politics.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by cabalamat on Thursday September 17, 2020 @04:55PM (#24509840)
The Pirates came 3rd in Czechia with 14% of the vote last year.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_European_Parliament_elect...

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by read_if_gay_ on Thursday September 17, 2020 @01:51PM (#24507712)
That’s true. I was half joking because public opinion might differ.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by chki on Thursday September 17, 2020 @11:52AM (#24506143)
Volt comes to mind but they are relatively new and only have one parliamentarian in the EP https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volt_Europa?wprov=sfla1
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by antientropic on Thursday September 17, 2020 @10:15AM (#24504877)
Sort of: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_political_party

However they're primarily just groupings of like-minded national parties.

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by M2Ys4U on Thursday September 17, 2020 @06:52PM (#24510931)
I guess it depends on your definition of "political party".

The EU has what's called a "political party at European level", there are 10 of these registered and a few more that don't meet the criteria to register.[0]

Most of these parties - and in particular the biggest two, the EPP[1] and PES[2] - don't allow individuals to become members.

Instead their members are political parties at national and regional parties that already exist in the member states.

One or two of the other parties are built around member states' parties, but also offer individual membership. ALDE,[3] the third-largest party, is one that does.

There are a few more parties that are active but don't meet the criteria to register.

The Pirate Party,[4] already mentioned by others, is one, but that too is a party-of-parties.

Volt Europa[5] is probably the only serious attempt at creating Europarty that is comprised predominantly of individuals, although even they allow for national-level parties as members in their statutes.

What can make things slightly confusing is that in the European Parliament MEPs don't actually formally sit as parties, but rather as political groups, of which there are 7. There are MEPs that don't sit in a group, but these tend to be more fringe parliamentarians, typically on the far-right.

The EPP and PES are big enough to have groups (EPP and S&D, respectively) that are more or less coterminous with their parties, but the other parties work together.

The European Greens sit with the European Free Alliance[6] along with the Pirate Party and Volt Europa, for example.

----------

[0] Regulation 1141/2014 [7] lays down the requirements. Amongst the details of the legal restrictions that have to be adhered to is the requirement to have elected representatives, or achieve 3% in European Parliament elections, in at least 1/4 of the member states.

[1] The European People's Party (EPP), this is the party of both the current Commission President and Merkel: https://www.epp.eu/

[2] The Party of European Socialists: https://www.pes.eu/en/

[3] https://www.aldeparty.eu/

[4] https://european-pirateparty.eu/

[5] https://www.volteuropa.org/

[6] These are mostly sub-national regionalist and/or separatist parties. https://www.e-f-a.org/

[7] https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32...

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by mschuster91 on Thursday September 17, 2020 @09:39AM (#24504448)
> CDU might be considered conservative by Western European standards, but it's liberal by Eastern European standards.

Which is mostly a result of Eastern European countries turning outright fascist (Hungary) or religious-authoritarian (Poland), it's a classic game of shifting goalposts.

CDU also was modernized by Merkel after the right-wing conservatives got booted off/sidetracked in the early '00s following a massive donation / tax scandal ("Schreiber-Spendenaffäre") and so the CDU still enjoyed wide popularity as a result, while the Eastern European conservatives never had that push.

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by Woodi on Friday September 18, 2020 @02:11AM (#24513465)
>> CDU might be considered conservative by Western European >> standards, but it's liberal by Eastern European standards.

> Which is mostly a result of Eastern European countries > turning outright fascist (Hungary) or religious- > authoritarian (Poland), it's a classic game of shifting > goalposts.

You are seriously wrong aka naive or intentionally missing truth.

a) current Hungary and Poland ruling parties just trying to make their countries strong, finish with some colonialism-like practices. Nothing fashist or autoritarism here. b) liberal and socialist (ex commies hire) disqualificate themselves via scams and -gates, stupidity and not doing ANYTHING for their own ppls.

You should better start to be concern about democracy in France (military state by now), Germany (censorship) and Espana (country suicide).

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by krageon on Thursday September 17, 2020 @10:02AM (#24504717)
That's more a reflection on how incredibly broken Eastern Europe is. Definitely not a stick to measure anything by. Just like how we do not measure political leaning by US standards (spoiler alert: everything is left wing).
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by 9HZZRfNlpR on Thursday September 17, 2020 @04:58PM (#24509877)
Social issues are definetly not, every single country in Europe would cringe on Californian liberals and think they were high on something. Don't agree with that what so all.
Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by iterativ on Thursday September 17, 2020 @12:15PM (#24506482)
They want more or less government spending ? They accept that the structure of the family will change ? Example, families with more than two parents (that is a real possibility due to overpopulation). They want less or more police ? Reform the prison system (even dissolve it), maybe ? What are their views on immigration ? Multiculturalism ? Should we tax the wealthy more or less ?

Of course, there are different political ideologies. It's not just a popularity contest.

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by thefounder on Thursday September 17, 2020 @01:26PM (#24507381)
>> Example, families with more than two parents (that is a real possibility due to overpopulation)"

For some reasons I thought Europe has an aging population issue and demographic decline not overpopulation.

>> families with more than two parents

I never heard of this unless you consider divorced people.

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by Perseids on Thursday September 17, 2020 @02:02PM (#24507877)
>> families with more than two parents

> I never heard of this unless you consider divorced people.

Look for articles concerning co-parenting, that's where its most often discussed. Wikipedia: "Co-parenting is an enterprise undertaken by two or more adults who together take on the socialization, care, and upbringing of children for whom they share equal responsibility[1] Co-parents may include a variety of configurations, including a mother and a father, two mothers, two fathers, a parent with an adult sibling or grandparent, or a parent and another adult relative. The co-parent relationship differs from an intimate relationship between adults in that it focuses solely on the child."

The other typical configuration would be in polyamorous relationships, when more than two of the partners decide to take responsibility of the child. Granted "typical" is a bit of a difficult word when we're talking about niche concepts. Most of my friends and coworkers have never heard about co-parenting or any other of the more diverse and sometimes complex family-alike structures, unless they concern failed relationships (see divorces). Which is kind of a bummer, that only failure in previous relationships motivates them to experiment with other concepts.

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by thefounder on Thursday September 17, 2020 @03:22PM (#24508816)
>> Most of my friends and coworkers have never heard about co-parenting or any other of the more diverse and sometimes complex family-alike structures.

I don't think it's worth to mangle obscure/exotic issues with mainstream subjects (overpopulation).

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by ClumsyPilot on Thursday September 17, 2020 @12:41PM (#24506827)
> "They accept that the structure of the family will change ? Example, families with more than two parents (that is a real possibility due to overpopulation)"

What does this mean? How is alleged population related to family structure and sexual relations?

Re:Germany will violate international agreements with Unitar... by Perseids on Thursday September 17, 2020 @02:27PM (#24508229)
I think grandparent was alluding to a separation of the two concepts of sexual relations and family structure: (Two or more) People can decide to bring up a child together without being in a romantic/sexual relationship. (Two or more) People can be in a romantic and/or sexual relationship without sharing responsibility of a child of one of the partners. Under this prerequisite, a family is any close social connection surrounding children (and the closeness and type of closeness being the linchpin of whether the term applies – not every flat share is a family for instance).

Regarding overpopulation: One motivation that I've heard quite often is that one of the most effective ways to reduce your carbon footprint is to have one child less. This is always presented with the asterisk that this is of course a very personal decision and there is the understanding that this is not a standard under which you will be measured. Still, if you're just looking at the numbers, that's what you get. Sharing parentage with more than two people is an alluring way to achieve the same result, especially as it means you will retain more of your personal time when child care is shouldered by three (or more) people.