You should almost certainly be going outside for the other health benefits.

There's very little risk of transmission if you're outside and 2m away from other people, even if intermittently you're closer than that. Even more so if one or the other of you is masked.

Places to be more concerned about are bottlenecks like lobbies and elevators on the way to/from outside.

My understanding is that it hasn’t been shown for elevators. I think this is because of the required time to breathe in a minimal viral load. Do you have evidence otherwise?

You're in a confined space, breathing the same air as other people. Also, given the frequent traffic of elevators, consider what you may breath in from previous occupants. This sounds risky to me. I hate touching elevator buttons during normal times. I'd wear masks and gloves.

> My understanding is that it hasn’t been shown for elevators. I think ...

Where are you getting this understanding? You are asking for evidence while providing none yourself...

Well the absence of anything is the default, so the burden of proof is on the person making the claim. I had read that somewhere in studying transmissions in NYC where elevators are common. I don’t remember where, it was a while ago.

> Well the absence of anything is the default, so the burden of proof is on the person making the claim.

I'm not sure the concept of "burden of proof" is helpful in a collaborative fact-seeking discussion. It seems more relevant to adversarial debates and trials.

It really depends on what the potential hazards are for the claim being correct versus the claim being incorrect. If the claim is that you can't get it from sharing an elevator, I would say the hazards if that claim is wrong are much greater than if that claim is correct. So, from a risk-management perspective, without any evidence, it's much better to assume that you can get COVID-19 from sharing an elevator until enough evidence accumulates to demonstrate that you can't. If you assume you can, the worst that happens is that you wait for another elevator. But if you assume you can't and you actually can, then you get COVID-19.

If I live in a high-rise, then there are large problems in avoiding elevators that could be worse. If all residents were to use stairs, aside from cardiac difficulties of some, mobility issues, risks of falling when carrying large loads, etc, there’s also going to be great amounts of aerosols generated by the huffing and puffing of many people using the stairs all day long (possibly in close proximity for multiple people going up at the same time). This could be a far larger vector as you’d be in the stairwell longer than you’d be in an elevator (https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/php/public-health-... suggests 15 minutes of exposure needed).

It’s not clear that “avoid elevators” is universally less harmful. Also given the 15 minutes suggested it’s not clear that elevators by default pose a risk, and the large numbers in use in the world make it surprising if they are indeed a major vector but are otherwise undocumented or not part of suggested guidelines thus far.

I’m asking for evidence which shows they are indeed a risk factor, which should also hopefully take into consideration mask usage and number of stories. This would be extremely useful for people to factor in if they need to move, for example.

A recent article in the Emerging Infectious Diseases Journal details how a large COVID-19 outbreak in China was traced back to one asymptomatic individual who infected a neighbor when they used the same elevator in their apartment building — though they were not in the elevator at the same time.

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/9/20-1798_article

There is a lot of evidence that close quarters, inside contact is very risky for transmission; every country in the world is operating under that assumption, indeed most are passing laws based on this. There is zero reason to believe that elevators ... both close quarters and inside would some how be an exception.

You've claimed that elevators are an exception to the established guidelines without evidence and are now claiming that that other, well evidenced, claim some how needs additional support to be applied to elevators.

Because it’s not just distance but time, often being suggested to be 15 minutes: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/php/public-health-...

Yes I heard planes as well surprisingly safe relative to choir practice. Environments where lots of droplets are created are less safe...

My understanding is that planes have very effective air filtration and movement systems. Choir practice likely would not, and involved people generating aerosols continuously.

I wonder how safe it is to queue at an airport, walk to the plane on a ramp among 100 yawning, coughing others, and reverse that process on the other side.

It may negate the safety of the actual airplane trip, or it may not.

planes have two things going for them: good air circulation with filtration, and mask-wearing is well enforced.

No evidence, just caution.

You can always go outside to locations that aren't crowded.

I've been taking Vitamin D3 5000 IU and Vitamin K2 MK-7 100 mcg daily since February to boost my immune system, and I've noticed a radical difference in my colds.

I used to get a major cold every 2-3 month and they were really bad lasting two weeks with fever, fatigue, coughs, colds, really stuffy nose, etc. Now? The two colds I've had were over in a week and the symptoms were so incredibly mild - mostly a light runny nose - that I'm legit grateful when I get a cold.

Regardless of vitamin D's effect on covid-19, the supplement has already paid off big time as far as I'm concerned. I've started to take 1g of vitamin C for the same reason, i.e. to boost my immune system. I should add that I live in a Nordic country with long dark winters and that I can't/don't go outside as much as I should.

Just some random suggestions from someone on the internet, but colds don't usually cause fevers, so if you've been getting sick with a fever every 2-3 months you may want to get that checked out.

It's also surprising that you've gotten 2 colds in the past few months when it sounds like you have been taking precautions due to covid-19. Seems like any exposure where you could catch a cold could easily have been Covid-19 instead, so you may want to re-evaluate your mask use, physical distancing, and hygiene practices.

Are you sure you just aren't getting colds because of better hygiene, and less contact with others? Without controlling for social distancing, you can't reasonably conclude that it was the vitamin D.

I haven't had a cold since we initially locked-down in April, which is very unusual for me, but completely explained by social distancing.

Oh I absolutely believe that social distancing and better hygiene are the reasons why I've gotten so few colds this year but those actions can't fully explain the decrease in severity. My colds have gone from being absolutely miserable to barely noticeable and are over in a week or less. I could be totally wrong but I'm not willing to remove vitamin d/k/c from my diet just to validate the hypothesis.

> you can't reasonably conclude that it was the vitamin D.

Except you can, because that is the conclusion of at least one other study of the effect of Vitamin D. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16959053/

Vitamin C is fine.

Careful with Vitamin D. When you get a chance, go see your doctor and ask him to check your vitamin D levels. Don't forget to tell them you are taking suplements.

I would guess that the social measures to combat covid have also had a big effect on the circulation of cold and flu viruses.

Don't really know why you haven't found the most obvious explanation for why you've gotten fewer colds.

Vitamin D has a direct effect on colds.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5949172/

Ok, but you know what has a really really direct effect on colds?

I swear, it's like people don't understand why we measure R_t. propagation is sigmoidal phenomenon. A reduction in transmission by 10% can easily lead to a reduction in prevalence by nearly 100%.

Another study to back you up: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16959053/

Obviously thought about that but the intensity of the colds is way different.

Be careful.

Vitamin D is a hormone and is not risk-free. Unless you have been prescribed by your doctor.

In general, be careful with any fat-soluble "vitamins", as they can build up.

A daily dose of 2000-4000 is enough and is very safe.

42% of Americans are deficient, much more the darker your skin is.

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/vitamin-d-deficiency-sy...

Could help explain why COVID-19 is much more severe (on average) if you’re black...

It's definitely a factor!

The literature states 1000-2000 is safe for basically anyone, but you really shouldn't be taking more than that without actually going to a doctor and getting your deficiency confirmed. Just because you have darker skin, it doesn't mean taking a higher oral dose won't cause other issues.

IIRC daily doses above 2000 over a longer timespan can (infrequently) cause your vitamin B12 levels to fall off, and/or the amount of calcium in your blood to build up, so your doctor might want to schedule a follow-up appointment after some time has passed to make sure those levels still look okay, and adjust supplements for those variables accordingly.

If you have an easy access doctor around to ask, I completely agree with that!

If you're not going to see a doctor about this, for laziness/poverty/whatever reasons, I think the average risk from not taking Vitamin D is vastly bigger than the risk from taking it.

You would have to take crazy amounts of vitamin D - more than 250 mcg (10000 IU) - for it to be toxic [0][1].

[0] https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/85/1/6/4649294

[1] https://asbmr.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1359/jbmr....

Over a prolonged period of time...

I got my D3 levels up to 478nmol/L according to the UK NHS Vit D blood spot service. Supplemented up to starting point of around 200-240nmol/L and then spent the summer outside with top off working on laptop. Never felt so good. Bought some Lizard flo tubes after that to bask under after I was craving a suntan one winter. Odd feeling, but I was also doing alot of magnesium sulphate (Mag oil) topically which helps and some zinc orally. The Mag oil stings the skin much like Deep Heat, so be warned and thinner skinned individuals will experience more pain.

400mg = 400000mcg = 16000000ui https://www.azcalculator.com/calc/vitamin-d-mcg-iu-converter...

This is kind of a silly thing to be worried about with Vitamin D.

Yes it's fat soluble. But the amount you would need to take in supplements to cause a problem is enormous. (Every vitamin is different)

You could probably take an entire bottle and you'd be fine.

The patients in this study were being given 10x the RDA, about 20k IU/day.

You can very very easily get 25k IU out in the sun and your body has no issues.

It's safe to take 2000IU/day and make sure to get sun if possible.

A few days ago, a blog post by a physician was stressing this same point. She was suggesting to be especially cautious with high doses.

High doses don't have much of a health benefit either. It's low doses on a daily basis.

Through in the UK the NHS were handing out high doses of Vitamin D like cotton candy last winter.