News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by Retric on Thursday August 27, 2020 @11:46AM (#24294815)
Hurricanes don’t impact much of the US. Nebraska for example has zero hurricane risks, and while low it’s has some terrorism risks. Also, in terms of preparation that can have positive returns it’s not clear FEMA actually needs to spend that much on Hurricanes per year. 10 year old flood maps still work just fine etc.

So, this may actually be completely reasonable behavior based on FEMA’s mandates.

Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by jcranmer on Thursday August 27, 2020 @11:52AM (#24294880)
Atlantic hurricanes have cost $400 billion of damage in the last 5 years alone.

The total damage caused by all terrorist attacks, worldwide, in the 21st century probably amounts to the damage caused by an average year of Atlantic hurricanes. Add in the Pacific hurricane season, which is generally worse, and it's clear that hurricanes cause far more damage than terrorism does.

Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by Retric on Thursday August 27, 2020 @11:58AM (#24294955)
It’s not FEMA’s job to reduce physical damage. That’s what building codes etc are for. FEMA’s job is to coordinate responses to save lives in the short term and rebuild infrastructure in the long term. Hurricanes do a lot of damage, but rarely kill people in the US.
Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by egypturnash on Thursday August 27, 2020 @12:39PM (#24295459)
There are new FEMA grant programs for 2020 that will disburse $660 million in funding for what the agency calls “pre-disaster mitigation,” focusing on resiliency against flooding and the relocation of vulnerable communities. Last year, however, approximately 75% of FEMA’s total preparedness grants went to the programs with counter-terrorism links, according to the GAO report.

-the article at hand

Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by coldcode on Thursday August 27, 2020 @12:06PM (#24295036)
Tell that to the people who died in New Orleans in Katrina due to ACOE's terrible levees.
Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by jjcon on Thursday August 27, 2020 @12:10PM (#24295102)
Just because people have died in a natural disaster doesn’t make it FEMAs job to prevent building damage. Not sure what you’re getting at
Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by AnimalMuppet on Thursday August 27, 2020 @12:56PM (#24295667)
I believe that coldcode is pushing back on Retric's statement that hurricanes rarely kill people in the US. But, OK, coldcode found a counterexample. That doesn't make "rarely" untrue, no matter how much we all remember the counterexample.
Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by thatcat on Thursday August 27, 2020 @02:37PM (#24297011)
Rarity is relative to the comparison, is it rare compared to terror deaths?
Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by jcranmer on Thursday August 27, 2020 @12:12PM (#24295125)
Hurricane Florence alone killed more people in the US than any terrorist attack since 9/11. All hurricane deaths in Trump's term alone (predominantly Florence, Harvey, Irma), excluding Maria, have killed more people than all terrorism attacks since 9/11 combined. Hurricane Maria killed more than 9/11.
Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by Retric on Thursday August 27, 2020 @04:17PM (#24298153)
If you’re looking at the excess deaths after Maria then you need to do the same thing for 9/11. By one estimate 221 policemen died as a result of medical issues from 9/11 which don’t make the official figures based on initial deaths. Dust inhalation etc very much killed people only indirectly involved on 9/11. Thus, any kind of apples to apples comparison of either direct or direct + indirect deaths put 9/11 as a significantly more deadly event.

PS: Also that extrapolation on death rates for Maria is extremely questionable as it’s been rising in Porto Rico for years. The increase from 2013 to 2014 is larger than the increase for 2016 to either 2017 or 2018. https://www.statista.com/statistics/580903/death-rate-in-pue... You can assume the only thing bad that happened was a hurricane, but the data really doesn’t support that.

Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by jcranmer on Thursday August 27, 2020 @05:15PM (#24298760)
You've lost sight of your own argument in the weeds of specific numbers here.

The broader point I'm making is this: hurricanes in the SE US and the Caribbean are, to a large degree "expected" disasters. As such they can be planned for, and damage can be minimized. And, I believe what you want to say is that they aren't all that "bad" anymore because of proper disaster preparation.

I would agree that hurricanes shouldn't be all that devastating in effect. But the data shows, quite convincingly IMHO, that we aren't doing as good as we could be doing in actually preparing for them.

Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by Retric on Thursday August 27, 2020 @08:44PM (#24300316)
My point has nothing to do with what we should be doing just what FEMA should be doing. They have a very important but also very specific role. Other organizations are supposed to prevent levees from overtopping, keep buildings standing, etc. FEMA is there for redundancy so that such instances are mitigated after the fact.

When it comes to hurricanes that equates to selecting evacuation routes and locations to shelter the storm etc. If needed they may help create such shelters, but that stuff really seems to be working well. What happens after the storm is largely a question of how well other organizations have done their job. Aka what percentage of homes are habitable translates into how many people FEMA needs to find shelter for.

However, that last bit is a real question. Do we ramp up FEMA’s ability to build temerity houses or reduce the need for such temporary houses? I think it’s clear FEMA could do a much better job in disaster aftermath, but for hurricanes I think that’s largely solving the wrong problem.

Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by jjcon on Thursday August 27, 2020 @12:08PM (#24295069)
You act as if all that damage could be prevented by FEMA.

The point is there is only so much you CAN do to prevent damage from a hurricane but there is a lot you can do to prevent a terrorist attack.

Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by adrianN on Thursday August 27, 2020 @12:08PM (#24295067)
Terrorist attacks were responsible for at least one expensive war.
Re:FEMA Spends More Preparing for Terrorism Than Hurricanes by egypturnash on Thursday August 27, 2020 @12:38PM (#24295447)
You know, there are other kinds of natural disasters. Remember a few weeks ago when something called a "derecho" tore across Middle America - starting from Nebraska? https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/10/weather/derecho-forecast-chic...

Ever hear of something called an "earthquake"? Strikes with absolutely no warning, most of the US's tech hotspots are either right on top of a fault line, or in the path of a tsunami caused by one out in the ocean.

I'm sure you will be completely fine with the government continuing to earmark most FEMA funds for "counter-terrorism" when you're affected by one of these. Especially if it's in a year where the President has just drained most of the non-terror funds by swiping them for something else, like he did this year:

The Trump administration recently ordered FEMA to divert $44 billion from the agency’s disaster-relief fund to pay for federal unemployment benefits. The measure was a stopgap after Congress failed to enact another Covid-19 stimulus package. - the article at hand