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Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by oxymoran on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @01:13PM (#24212893)
The stock market is not the economy, that is absolutely true. But why exactly is that made clearer right now? Considering we have been in a pandemic for 5 months now, I would say we are faring pretty well economically. Consumer spending is back up. Unemployment is going back down. The real estate market is healthy. Prices are stable. There are certainly people and industries not doing well and we should help them. There are also people and industries doing really well right now. I have seen no proof that the overall economy is hurting.
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by ceejayoz on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @01:19PM (#24213017)
31M people just recently lost the $600 weekly unemployment boost that was keeping them afloat. (https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/08/06/600-dolla...) Tens of millions are facing eviction in the coming months. (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/eviction-23-million-october/)

The damage from this is just getting started, we're already in recession, and the stock market is setting all-time highs. It's a bit bizarre.

Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by dkdk8283 on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @01:43PM (#24213391)
My customer owns a metal factory and complained about this: the unemployment boost made it impossible for him to fill low level positions as most would make more to stay home.
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by mywittyname on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @03:01PM (#24214661)
I think that explanation is more of a political talking point than reality. I guess if you make people desperate enough, then they will start looking for new jobs. But I think he's grossly underestimating what's going on with society.

Most people on unemployment are laid off. They are not applying for new jobs because they assume that they will have a job to go back to shortly.

These people are also dealing with the clusterfuck surrounding schooling & childcare. From what I've seen, it's close to impossible to get your younger child back into childcare. The older ones taking remote classes in school require a good deal of adult attention.

I don't think a lot of people would change jobs even for a big raise because things are so hectic right now. Even people here on HN are struggling to balance their lives, and these are people who earn good wages and have a lot of flexibility with their schedule.

Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by asdff on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @02:28PM (#24214120)
You are taking a risk coming off unemployment in a pandemic. If you get laid off again, good luck getting back on unemployment. If people aren't taking the job, that means the pay is lower than the perceived risk to the worker, and should be raised.
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by orev on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @05:29PM (#24216821)
During a pandemic, that’s the point! You don’t want desperate people staying in the workforce and spreading the virus which kills more people. Having people stay home is what was supposed to happen!
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by calmworm on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @02:37PM (#24214267)
So, pay more?
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by cloakandswagger on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @01:58PM (#24213636)
Not bizarre at all if you think about it. The economic hardship will motivate a substantial portion of our population to become more industrious. They'll fill any available job and do it productively since they're now at or below the poverty line.

The stock market is setting new highs in anticipation of a renaissance in worker efficiency and business margins.

Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by chickenpotpie on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @02:25PM (#24214068)
Can we stop perpetuating this idea that poverty is going to make people work super hard to escape? It’s a debilitating state that traps people. It’s not a blessing of motivation. Studies have show poverty lowers IQ and overall health in almost every way. Happy, financially secure workers are productive ones. Hard to focus on your job when you’re wondering where your next meal is coming from and which bills you can push off until your next paycheck.
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by cloakandswagger on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @02:34PM (#24214216)
I question and reject the conclusion of any such study based on my own experience.
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by mywittyname on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @03:11PM (#24214795)
Your thesis has an implication that is readily checked:

If living poverty makes people more industrious, then people who grew up in poverty should have better outcomes than people who never have.

And that's pretty well proven to by false. In fact, there's a name for all of the negative effects of living in poverty that perpetuate a life in poverty: the cycle of poverty.

Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by chickenpotpie on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @02:37PM (#24214271)
You’re rejecting the conclusion of studies that you haven’t even read?
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by dragonwriter on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @02:35PM (#24214243)
Anecdote > data?
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by cloakandswagger on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @02:37PM (#24214277)
Personal observations and reasoning > crooked, conclusion-oriented "studies"
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by chickenpotpie on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @02:41PM (#24214339)
Actually reading a study, researching who conducted and funding it, and their methods > calling a study crooked because it disagrees with your world views
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by EliRivers on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @03:47PM (#24215338)
Your own words betray you. You've got your conclusions already. I bet you ascribe your lucky breaks to personal qualities too.
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by disambiguation on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @03:21PM (#24214958)
Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by lm28469 on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @01:55PM (#24213591)
> we are faring pretty well economically.

"We" as in "tech workers making several times the min wage" ? Or "we" as "people who already lived in precarious conditions before covid" ?

Not to rain on your parade but _a lot_ of people are _very badly_ affected by the situation, especially in the US.

Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by wjossey on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @01:28PM (#24213167)
Other than GDP cratering in Q2 or massive unemployment, with incomes only remaining stable because we gave the vast majority of Americans $1,200 checks and $2,400 income boost if they were unemployed?

We're not even in the first inning of this crisis - We're still in batting practice. The ripples and waves of this crisis will probably (just my arm chair opinion) last for years, if not the next decade.

But, hey, who knows! Maybe it'll all be over and done with next spring post vaccine. We'll be back to 4% unemployment and it'll be like it never happened from an economic perspective. Seems unlikely to me, but I'm not an economist.

Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by mywittyname on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @03:19PM (#24214936)
> Maybe it'll all be over and done with next spring post vaccine. We'll be back to 4% unemployment and it'll be like it never happened from an economic perspective.

I don't bet on this happening, but it is certainly a possible outcome.

A lot of the issues we are facing are the result of supply shortages due to people not being able to operate in close proximity to one another. If not for Covid, then it's likely that the economy would have continued to grow.

If you think about it, the US economy continued to grow over the past decade even while the collapse of the retail, energy, and agricultural sectors during that time frame. Once people are able to return to being in large groups, it's not unreasonable to expect growth to continue.

Re:U.S. Stocks Rise After S&P 500’s Record Close by jarym on Wednesday August 19, 2020 @01:27PM (#24213140)
Well travel is a huge part of almost every economy and they remain hit.