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Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by XMPPwocky on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @11:51AM (#24133257)
Tragically, the state has also taken away my right to sell my kidneys for money, just trying to "protect" me. I'm an adult, if I want the money isn't it strictly better than I have the freedom to cash in on my human resources?
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by dang on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @02:59PM (#24135509)
We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24133102.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by lghh on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @12:16PM (#24133558)
> I'm an adult, if I want the money isn't it strictly better than I have the freedom to cash in on my human resources?

Yes.

Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by typest on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @12:25PM (#24133655)
To add onto this —- living with only one kidney rather than two only barely increases your risk of dying, and many people each year die due to lack of kidneys. So, creating a market here (regulated of course) would save a lot of lives.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by missedthecue on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:33PM (#24134518)
Iran has an organ market and his has been a large success and has a very low rate of regret.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by teachrdan on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:52PM (#24134759)
It would likely coerce poor Americans into selling their kidneys to the wealthy so that they could pay off their student debt. Is coercing the poor to sell their organs to the rich a net benefit for society?

For anyone who thinks this is hyperbole, ProPublica has done excellent work investigating how lenders use the court system to imprison Americans who can't pay back their debts: https://www.google.com/search?q=propublica+debtors+prisons

Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by creddit on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @02:15PM (#24135011)
You and I have very different views of coercion. Making a choice possible is not coercing people into that choice.

Debtors prisons are bad but of course that’s a separate issue.

Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by exolymph on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @02:19PM (#24135071)
"Coerce" in the sense that poor people would notice a way to make money and go after it?
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by teachrdan on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @04:40PM (#24136681)
Coerce in that someone will now have the "choice" of selling an organ or going to jail.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by huntertwo on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:23PM (#24134394)
To further add on, I doubt rich people die because of lack of kidneys and I think they'd be the only ones to benefit from that.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by creddit on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @02:17PM (#24135039)
You can tell that to my Aunt whose husband died because he couldn’t get a kidney. They would’ve gladly paid $100K and worked a couple more years before retiring if he could’ve lived.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by ardy42 on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:29PM (#24134471)
>> I'm an adult, if I want the money isn't it strictly better than I have the freedom to cash in on my human resources [by selling my kidney]?

> Yes.

By this logic, slavery should be legal, because people should have the freedom to sell themselves into it (for instance, to purchase medical care for a loved one).

Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by frockington1 on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @02:14PM (#24134996)
Yes. But that wouldn't be slavery really because you are working for a predetermined rate.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by ardy42 on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @03:22PM (#24135726)
> Yes. But that wouldn't be slavery really because you are working for a predetermined rate.

Huh? I literally said the person would be selling themselves into slavery, which means becoming chattel property with no rights of any kind. That's nothing like a non-slave "working for a predetermined rate," because those workers still have rights since they're not property.

Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by r29vzg2 on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @12:45PM (#24133877)
You’ll be surprised by the answers to this on HN.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by mindcrime on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:41PM (#24134619)
I'm an adult, if I want the money isn't it strictly better than I have the freedom to cash in on my human resources?

Yes.

Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by cscurmudgeon on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:56PM (#24134812)
Selling a kidney is totally the same as part-time driving.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by sneak on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:09PM (#24134206)
I have yet to hear a single reasonable, moral argument for anyone having a higher authority over what happens to your kidneys than you yourself.
Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by XMPPwocky on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:36PM (#24134542)
It's a commitment device.

Sometimes it can be beneficial to you to remove your own options- if you can prove to others that you've removed that option.

For example, look at the prisoners' dilemma. If both prisoners were able to commit, ahead of time, to not defect, this would be better for both prisoners. By removing a choice, and proving you have removed that choice, you actually get a better outcome than what would be possible if you could choose to defect.

This applies in asymmetric situations, too, like contract negotiations given a significant imbalance of bargaining power. It can be beneficial to the worker to, say, prevent themselves from ever agreeing to work in unsafe conditions, even if the boss offers extra pay for it (which the worker might want).

Thus selling organs, or selling your children to "adoptive" parents. It's not about somebody else having "authority"- it's about you intentionally burning bridges, provably pre-committing, removing the "choice" to do things which, on a societal level, could be harmful.

Re:Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down tempora... by sneak on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @04:18PM (#24136393)
> It can be beneficial to the worker to, say, prevent themselves from ever agreeing to work in unsafe conditions, even if the boss offers extra pay for it (which the worker might want).

Who better to decide if that is beneficial or not than the worker themself?