News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by throwaway5752 on Sunday August 02, 2020 @03:11PM (#24030822)
I wish I hadn't mentioned the pension, because it takes away from the immediate and much worse problem that the governing party is trying to stay in power by preventing members of the other party from voting.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by phkahler on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:00PM (#24032140)
How are dems more likely to vote by mail? And what are the percentages for each party?
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by throwaway5752 on Sunday August 02, 2020 @09:21PM (#24033254)
Short answer is the effect should be even overall, but what matters happens at state and district levels, so you could even disenfranchise more people of your own party on the net and still end up with an improved electoral outcome.

You could steal the vote from 500k Republicans in just Alabama and 150k Democrats spread across Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania and have a net swing of 0 EC votes lost and 50 EC votes gained for Republicans.

You just have to create policies (like closing polling place, making vote by mail difficult, create voter id rules that exclude college students) that have small partisan differentials in a few swing states, which is why the greatest effort and impact is in urban centers in the midwest (followed by Latinx populations in the southwest like AZ and NM, and African American populations in the southeast like FL and GA).

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by mcguire on Sunday August 02, 2020 @07:29PM (#24032693)
Most large urban areas are Democratic. In the time of COVID, would you rather vote by mail or wait in line at overcrowded voting locations?
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by tedunangst on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:27PM (#24032325)
Dems are more likely to be affected by polling station closures and consolidation, so that e.g. all of Detroit has to vote in a single location.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by faitswulff on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:47PM (#24032459)
They are not. Republican leadership is convinced they are but consider this quote from https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/510040-gop-fears-trump... :

> The R Street Institute, a think tank dedicated to free markets and limited government, recently released a study titled “Why conservatives should embrace sensible measures to expand absentee balloting.”

> The study cast doubt on claims that Democrats benefit from expanded mail-in voting, pointing to three states Trump carried in 2016 — Utah, Arizona and Montana — where about 70 percent of voters cast ballots through the mail.

GOP leadership is just totally unhinged.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by pstuart on Sunday August 02, 2020 @04:16PM (#24031346)
If voting is effectively curtailed, everything else is moot. This election is a referendum on (American) democracy.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by shredprez on Sunday August 02, 2020 @04:55PM (#24031672)
If voting is effectively curtailed, can it really be called a referendum?
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by johnchristopher on Sunday August 02, 2020 @04:34PM (#24031480)
Hmm. Wasn't that referendum settled in 2016 ? Trump is 30 years in the making.

Unless there's a swing back to restoring democratic norms there's no reasons the coming years are going to be much different, no matter who is elected president.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by pstuart on Sunday August 02, 2020 @04:46PM (#24031583)
No, this is different. Trump at that time was a "why the fuck not" to people who hated the current climate and wanted "change". He was an "unknown" as far as the governance he would provide.

If Biden is able to take office I expect work to be done to try to salvage things.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by ThrowawayR2 on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:28PM (#24032336)
> "Trump at that time was a 'why the fuck not' to people who hated the current climate and wanted 'change'."

Absolutely nothing prevents that from happening again. The economic, social, and political forces that disadvantaged large swathes of the public, riling them up enough to make them take a chance on Trump, are all still there. If anything, the fact that the COVID-19 recession is likely going to hit full force during the next administration and make their situation even worse makes voting for demagogues even _more_ likely. Biden isn't going to be able to wave a magic wand to fix the world even if he wins, which is not a given.

We're in for a bumpy ride.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by johnchristopher on Sunday August 02, 2020 @05:58PM (#24032131)
> No, this is different. Trump at that time was a "why the fuck not" to people who hated the current climate and wanted "change". He was an "unknown" as far as the governance he would provide.

But that climate, the white collar criminality, the nation wide rampant electoral schemes, the inequality haven't changed. What gave birth to Trump winning the 2016 election is still there. If I understand correctly, there's no reason republicans would support a democrat president trying to salvage thing considering they didn't prevent the swift acceleration in deterioration during the last four years.

Maybe Trump was an unknown as far as the governance he would provide but it was known what kind of individual he was (and to an extent what would happen if elected, in broad lines).

I don't know, I am in the final chapter of Sarah Kendzior "Hiding in Plain Sight: The Invention of Donald Trump and the Erosion of America" and things do look grim indeed.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by input_sh on Sunday August 02, 2020 @05:37PM (#24031999)
Democrats like to play nice ("by the rules"), Republicans (and Trump in particular) do not.

As a consequence, it'll take a lot more than one term to undo everything that Trump has done in one term, and the way things were before Trump wasn't really peachy either.

One Trump term is going to require at least a decade to undo, and that's if it remains at just one term. Now add climate change on top of that and the future looks pretty grim.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by newsclues on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:07PM (#24032195)
The idea that we would be voting in 2020 by mail is crazy.

I cannot believe that no one foresaw an election in a pandemic and said, “let’s build an app for this”

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by throwaway5752 on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:11PM (#24032222)
I think you are vastly underestimating the difficulty in automating this. This has been proposed for decades and there is published academic research about the extraordinary difficulty of ensuring the integrity of the voters and the tallies. You can look at literature on the challenges with REAL ID implementation or Healthcare.gov for similar and smaller projects.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by rabidrat on Sunday August 02, 2020 @08:42PM (#24033051)
Extremely relevant xkcd: https://xkcd.com/2030/
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by kryogen1c on Sunday August 02, 2020 @04:54PM (#24031666)
> the governing party is trying to stay in power by preventing members of the other party from voting.

since trump lost the popular vote in 2016, isnt your grand republican conspiracy both categorically false and totally meaningless if it werent?

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by ianleeclark on Sunday August 02, 2020 @05:37PM (#24031996)
How would a vote 4 years ago invalidate the very real and observable means of voter suppression we see today?
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by kryogen1c on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:08PM (#24032201)
Because he had less votes and won, so im not sure what this alleged widespread voter suppression is supposed to accomplish.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by fredophile on Monday August 03, 2020 @01:11AM (#24034411)
I'm pretty sure the alleged widespread voter suppression is supposed to accomplish a second term for Donald Trump as well as picking up some seats in both the Senate and House for his party.

Do you really believe that someone winning in the previous election is a guarantee that they would not try to suppress the vote in the current or future elections? If not, what point were you trying to make by bringing up the results of the 2016 election?

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by jb775 on Sunday August 02, 2020 @04:34PM (#24031486)
> by preventing members of the other party from voting

This is so absurdly dramatic. Just about everything is back open and ppl agree that wearing a mask basically removes all risk. If ppl want to vote, they can get off their ass and go vote.

And from a security standpoint, how can you say this with a straight face? Some of the hardest modern struggles in the tech industry revolve around security...and you're over here acting like mailing in paper ballots, with no authentication/encryption/verification is a secure practice. All it takes is one or a few bad actors to skew the results. Look up cognitive dissonance, I think it's hitting you hard here.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by chillwaves on Sunday August 02, 2020 @04:59PM (#24031697)
You will need to find some evidence of voter fraud for mail in ballots. Many states have it as an option and it hasn't happened. The military regularly votes by mail and it hasn't happened.

It's funny you open your reply about "absurdly dramatic" then lay an equally absurd claim about vote-by-mail having a problem with fraud.

Your reply also conveniently ignores the historical pattern of voter suppression coming from the Republican party.

It seems in America, some constitutional rights are more protected than others.

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Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by mcguire on Sunday August 02, 2020 @07:47PM (#24032777)
Some of the polling places will be open.

Louisville, Ky., with 600,000 people, gets one voting location today (https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/06/23/louisville-ky-with-60...)

Did Consolidating Polling Places in Milwaukee Depress Turnout? (https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/research-reports/did-...)

Polling Places Remain a Target Ahead of November Elections (https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/blogs/sta...)

IN SOUTH CAROLINA, A PEEK AT COVID-19’S IMPACT ON ELECTIONS (https://publicintegrity.org/politics/elections/in-south-caro...)

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by eggsmediumrare on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:28PM (#24032331)
Right, the bottom feeders... The people slaving away at two minimum wage jobs trying to make ends meet? The criminals... The small time weed dealers who decided they didn't want to work two minimum wage jobs to make ends meet? Demeaning these people shows you right there the misguided mindset of the arrogant.
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Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by eggsmediumrare on Sunday August 02, 2020 @07:56PM (#24032819)
Sometimes when you find yourself throwing out baseless accusations and making sweeping generalizations about the root causes of complex systemic issues, it can be useful to step back and ask yourself if your opinion is really bulletproof and rooted in reality, or if you just think it is.

btw calling people bottom feeders generally implies that you have a problem with them.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by waldoh on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:38PM (#24032392)
It's not often someone (100% sure you're a republican) just admits that they think some people's votes are more valuable than another.

All lives matter, right?

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by chillwaves on Sunday August 02, 2020 @07:32PM (#24032707)
The right to vote applies equally to everyone; this includes access.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by Simulacra on Sunday August 02, 2020 @05:09PM (#24031770)
But the military I think we can trust more than the Postal Service, every time we hear of a postal employee destroying or throwing away mail should be a significant enough reason that the agency is simply not ready to take this on. Maybe at the next election, maybe with a significantly more funding, transparency, and security, but not now. Mail in voting would be great, but not now. It’s far too dangerous.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by creato on Sunday August 02, 2020 @05:27PM (#24031918)
Tell that to people that live in Colorado, Oregon, Washington, or (mostly) Utah. They've been voting by mail for years.

I'd worry a lot more about computerized election systems before voting by mail. I think people are too worried about individual votes/errors. 0.0x% of ballots being lost/not counted/etc. is a problem with any election system ("hanging chads", signatures not matching well, ...), not just voting by mail. The question should be how hard is it to pull off a large scale disruption/fraud without being detected.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by tigershark on Sunday August 02, 2020 @05:57PM (#24032122)
Your own current president always votes by mail. If it’s fine for him why on Earth do you think that it’s not fine for everyone else?
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by chillwaves on Sunday August 02, 2020 @07:33PM (#24032711)
The coronavirus has been recognized as an issue since before March. The only reason why there is not better safeguards in place for vote by mail is because the ruling party does not want it to happen.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by mypalmike on Sunday August 02, 2020 @05:05PM (#24031734)
The fact that you're not familiar with the ballot authentication and verification mechanisms used in mail-in voting suggests a starting point for your research.
Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by fiblye on Sunday August 02, 2020 @07:03PM (#24032544)
Several states have had mail-in voting for years. It only became a political issue a few months ago, and only amongst one party.

Meanwhile, rigged voting machines that flip votes have been caught on camera countless times. Zero effort has been made to do anything about that.

Re:Mail delays hit Philadelphia residents, short staffed USP... by wtallis on Sunday August 02, 2020 @06:10PM (#24032212)
> All it takes is one or a few bad actors to skew the results.

Most elections aren't close enough for the outcome to be swung by the kind of paper ballot fraud that a single person is capable of committing. Unlike electronic hacks, paper ballot fraud doesn't scale.