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Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by cryptoz on Friday June 19, 2020 @04:51PM (#23578755)
Only remote Canadians, for now I think, in case some Canadians get excited (and didn't read past the headline). Not yet.

> Elon Musk's SpaceX has applied to offer high-speed internet to Canadians living in remote areas by beaming it to them via satellites.

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by blocked_again on Friday June 19, 2020 @04:54PM (#23578772)
Why will non remote Canadians get excited about high speed internet? They already have that.
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by xoa on Friday June 19, 2020 @05:07PM (#23578866)
>Why will non remote Canadians get excited about high speed internet? They already have that.

They do? I live in northern New England an hour so from the border and have some Canadian friends who complain that they have at best the same sort of mediocre 5-10/1-2 ADSL I did up until a year or two ago when fiber became available. They refer to their phone company as "the Jolly Roger" with all said connotations. Looking at this Canadian National Broadband Internet Service Availability Map seems to back that up too:

https://www.ic.gc.ca/app/sitt/bbmap/hm.html?lang=eng

Looks like even 50/10 let alone anything better has pretty minimal penetration, with a lot on really mediocre speeds providing wider areas. Even before sat<>sat optical, Starlink has potential to do a lot better for a lot more people. And once density gets good enough with sat<>sat links, Starlink may flat out offer better latency to remote parts of the world then existing connections thanks to the 40% speed benefit of c in a vaccum/air vs non-photonic bandgap fiber and a more point-to-point topology. That won't matter to everyone but it may be very valuable to certain remote workers.

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by tialaramex on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:13PM (#23579367)
> They do? I live in northern New England an hour so from the border and have some Canadian friends who complain that they have at best the same sort of mediocre 5-10/1-2 ADSL I did up until a year or two ago

People are often better at complaining than at remedying their situation.

Some years ago now I was at a friend's flat. He lamented that ASDL was poor. "They'll never offer anything better here" he said. I thought that was odd because I thought I'd seen a cabinet for his section of the district where we both live. So I suggested he check. He waved me off, no need to bother right because he's sure it isn't an option. So I typed his address into the checker and it said he could buy 80Mbps vDSL.

As a result of course he has 80Mbps vDSL. Now, if I'd just agreed "Yeah, it sucks" how long do you think he would have taken to realise he could buy faster service? A year? Five years? Maybe he'd still be moaning now on our Friday Jitsi call instead of complaining that the terrible webcam setup he cobbled together back in late March sucks?

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by xoa on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:44PM (#23579621)
This is kind of a weird response, do you disagree with that coverage map or something? I don't know about your friend, but it's not unreasonable to give technical people on HN a little more credit then that. I kept thoroughly abreast of every possible broadband option even in my area and I know they do too. "A friend's flat" doesn't sound like a semi-rural or rural zone, where as simple geography you can be miles away from even the nearest village. DSL falls off pretty hard with distance, when you're at 15000+ feet/5000+ meters there isn't much to be done, even with bonded lines (if that's even an option). Nearest cable TV service to me is about 3.5 miles off and has been that way for 20 years now at least. Various WISP efforts have added new possibilities in the last 5 years, but mountainous regions still result in very hit/miss service and since many of them are quite ad hoc and local performance is also hit/miss (though they're often a lot of fun to actually deal with, good technical enthusiastic people you can have a real conversation with and come up with creative solutions with like the old days). It's a real miracle that fiber came through here via our great local ISP, though another few houses/mile away and I'd have missed it. And now everything is on hold again due to lock down.

Starlink definitely will be able to at least smooth out the current total patchwork. The question will just be if it's a low density area and (while constellation is building and before optical interlink sats) if it's in a covered zone. Won't always be the best option I'm sure, but it won't be the case that two people a mere half mile away as the crow flies with a small hill between them have to deal with total feast/famine differences.

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by ghaff on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:36PM (#23579553)
But it's legitimately bad in a lot of places. My dad's house is on the coast near Acadia National Park and within about 10 minutes of what passes for a city in those parts. He's the last house on a road off the main road that gets broadband at all and it's ADSL that gets about 1Mbit down. You can't really do video. Houses further along the road need to do satellite or try their luck with pretty much equally mediocre cellular.

And people have investigated because basically not having internet is something of a pain but it is what it is.

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by BenjiWiebe on Saturday June 20, 2020 @02:12PM (#23585535)
You can't always trust the online address checker. In this case it was likely right, but CenturyLink's checker for our address has never been right. For a while it said far higher than what the tech said we could get, and now it shows lower than what we actually have.
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by TheCapn on Friday June 19, 2020 @04:58PM (#23578790)
Not sure of your knowledge of the Canadian Telecom market but in certain urban centers there's virtually no competition (or if there is competition its borderline collusion between our three major carriers). I know a lot of people wishing for competitive options to disconnect themselves from Rogers/Bell/Telus and would see this as something compelling.
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by def8cefe on Friday June 19, 2020 @05:06PM (#23578862)
>I know a lot of people wishing for competitive options to disconnect themselves from Rogers/Bell/Telus and would see this as something compelling.

They wouldn't when they realise that it is a cheaper alternative to existing satellite internet services, not cable internet. Also that it would have reception issues in urban and suburban areas which is why they are targeting rural areas.

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by rapind on Friday June 19, 2020 @05:06PM (#23578858)
It's a little more nuanced. Yes Bell and Rogers have a duopoly but they are also required to sell network access at a regulated wholesale rate to other ISPs (Teksavvy, start.ca, etc as Ontario examples). It's kind of a weird setup, but you can read more about it here. https://www.google.com/search?q=The+CRTC+requires+telephone+....

Quote: ------

The CRTC requires telephone and cable companies to sell access to their networks to independent Internet service providers (ISPs) at regulated wholesale prices.

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by greeniron on Friday June 19, 2020 @05:00PM (#23578809)
not sure about collusion between the big 3, but for both my mobile and internet provider (2 different ones), i've successfully pitted them against each other by calling to say i'm switching over to their competitor and repeatedly got discounts for it. i'm currently paying $45/mth for 20gb from Fido Pulse BYOD plan with unlimited talk and text, and for home internet i'm paying $55/mth for 750mbps fibre from Telus.
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by nicholascamera on Friday June 19, 2020 @05:09PM (#23578885)
Wow, teach me how! I pay $67 for 13GB data and $60 for 40mpbs at home in Montreal. Which province?
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by greeniron on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:27PM (#23579474)
this is in BC. every 3-4 months, i keep calling, ask for "customer retention department" and threaten to leave. sometimes i just say "got any promos for me?" and they'll just offer whatever they can. sometimes if they have an attitude, i just hang up and call back for another more friendly agent. i've done this for the past 2 yrs and always ends up with at least a new $5/mth discount added to my bill, so by now my bill is super low.
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by nicholascamera on Monday June 22, 2020 @09:42AM (#23600072)
I will give this a shot!
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by pletsch on Friday June 19, 2020 @05:37PM (#23579105)
13gb for $67? What the hell. I thought I had a great plan at 6 gbs for $55. I remember everyone getting the 10gb for $60 deal a while back but I missed out on that one.
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by nicholascamera on Monday June 22, 2020 @09:41AM (#23600067)
That's $67 before taxes. I'm with Virgin (not a recommendation). They tend to call every 6 months (less lately) and ask if I'm happy. I always say it costs too much and I want more data. They gave me two bonus packages (something like $5 for 1GB or 2GB). That's how I got to relatively cheap 13GB.

Nowadays they just look at other plans and say, nope, you're on something better than anything we offer now.

FWIW Fizz is the new hotness here. They have worse coverage outside of metros, cheaper base plans, zero phone customer service (problem for negotiating cheaper deals I imagine), and rollover data, which Virgin does not.

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by Reason077 on Saturday June 20, 2020 @05:01AM (#23582752)
> "Why will non remote Canadians get excited about high speed internet?"

I know Canada is a huge, sparsely populated country with many isolated, remote communities. But I'm astounded that "30 kilometres north of Toronto" is considered one of those locations so remote that you can't get fast, affordable internet service. So it seems like there are potentially a lot of "remote" Canadians.

Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by giarc on Friday June 19, 2020 @05:00PM (#23578805)
People may misinterpret what 'remote' means and just how bad the internet situation is. My father lives 45 minutes away from Toronto and until he spent a ton of money on a line-of-sight antenna a year ago, he basically had dial-up internet.
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by bdamm on Friday June 19, 2020 @04:53PM (#23578761)
Presumably by pricing it slightly above the existing providers they can resolve the problem of having too many customers.
Re:SpaceX applies to offer high-speed internet service to Ca... by jandrese on Friday June 19, 2020 @05:01PM (#23578822)
They might struggle to make a service that's worse than Rogers/Shaw. It's a pretty high bar.