Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threatens site

Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by cmiles74 on Thursday June 11, 2020 @08:53AM (#23488274)

Personally, I find it hard to be sympathetic to the publishers and authors when they are so over-the-top. Painting the Internet Archive as "vile" and claiming they don't provide any valuable service strikes me as so far from the truth as to be insulting. It feels like they are targeting people who don't really know much about what IA is or what they do... That makes me wonder if it's really about more than IA and their emergency lending program, but now I'm probably starting to sound paranoid.

I'm sure that some authors lost some dollars to this program, but is it really all that much? The coverage on the lawsuit doesn't mention how much injury the publishers (and, to a much lesser degree, their authors) have suffered.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by ben_w on Thursday June 11, 2020 @09:07AM (#23488393)

I’m writing a novel. I’ve been at it since 2016, partly because project planning is just as hard outside of software and partly because I have a full-time job too. Based on what people like Charlie Stross blog about, and based on the few sales estimates I can find, even if I reach the heady highs of ranking 214th biggest SciFi writer by sales, I will make less than $40k in lifetime sales for four year’s work.

As income goes, this is a lottery.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by a1369209993 on Thursday June 11, 2020 @02:13PM (#23491682)

This has little or nothing to do with any supposed reduction in book sales the Internet Archive or any other library, dead-tree or bittorrent, has caused, and quite a lot to do with publishers screwing authors out of royalties for books they do sell. I have no sympathy any author too stupid to realize that publishers are to blame for their still needing a day job after (for example of Myke Cole) twelve books, two TV shows, and a comic series.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by ben_w on Thursday June 11, 2020 @03:29PM (#23492489)

If piracy had zero or positive impact, a genuinely greedy publisher wouldn’t care or would actively encourage it.

When I do finally finish this thing and try to get it published, I will go though a normal publisher, because I like listening to the advice of people who’ve been though things before: https://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2013/03/why-i-d...

Also, no: most authors need day jobs because sales are a generally power-law distributions.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by Ensorceled on Thursday June 11, 2020 @09:48AM (#23488821)

Whoa, you have very inflated view of how much an author makes. I follow Myke Cole on Twitter his tag line is:

9 fantasy novels, 1 sci-fi novel, 2 history books, 2 TV shows, 1 comic series, 1 day job, 0 sleep

The guy has published 12 books and STILL needs a day job.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by zatel on Thursday June 11, 2020 @10:46AM (#23489467)

I'm not familiar with Myke Cole or his books. I'm sure they are quite good. I think that quality is more important then quantity though.

Some people on here seem to make one app and kick back for years on the earnings while others churn out one after the other unprofitable software tool.

I myself have written 3 novella, 1 book of short stories, 1 movie, 2 native apps, and 4 web apps. I can't live on the royalties from any of them but I know there are people who do less and get more.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by sukilot on Thursday June 11, 2020 @11:04AM (#23489647)

This is the fallacy of assuming that people would pay for content they can't pirate.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by cmiles74 on Thursday June 11, 2020 @11:56AM (#23490158)

I haven't seen any evidence that the shrinking earnings of authors are related to piracy. From what I've read, publishers are simply retaining more of the profits for themselves and, often, theorizing that piracy is somehow raising their costs yet providing little by way of documentation.

https://www.statista.com/topics/3928/reading-habits-in-the-u...

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by a1369209993 on Thursday June 11, 2020 @01:55PM (#23491492)

That's what sukilot said: it is a fallacy to assume that people would pay for content that they can't pirate. In actuality, it's the other way around: people pirate content that they can't pay for (either because they have no money (at all or in a currency that the publisher accepts), or because the publish refuses to deliver the content (either at all or in a format they can actully use, ie not DRM-encumbered or otherwise defective)).

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by ben_w on Thursday June 11, 2020 @03:39PM (#23492592)

That would be great if I’ve misunderstood and the Internet Archive is really only lending our books that aren’t for sale. (And, as is probably universal on this site, I think DRM in books is both bad and dumb: bad for accessibility, dumb because of how easy it is to OCR text).

Likewise, unless I misunderstood, they already had a legit lending library system set up, but they broke the rules and made it infinite free copies for everyone.

I hope there is a happy ending to this story, because I like the internet archive, but at the moment it looks like they got their legal advice from the same minds who came up with Freeman Of The Land.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by a1369209993 on Thursday June 11, 2020 @05:28PM (#23493447)

> That would be great if I've misunderstood and the Internet Archive is really only lending our books that aren't for sale.

I'm not sure if they are only lending books that aren't for sale, but my understanding is that the overwhelming majority of the books involved are in fact not available for purchase. A book that is only available in DRM-encumbered form is not available at all.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by chipotle_coyote on Thursday June 11, 2020 @01:09PM (#23490942)

It seems unlikely to me that piracy is a major factor, as headline-grabbing as it often tends to be. It's hard for me to even hazard a guess how the IA's "emergency library" would really affect things; it's not piracy in any conventional understanding of the term, but maybe that makes it more likely to cost authors potential sales, because it's so easy to read the book for free. But I want to triple underline that maybe and surround it with question marks.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by Ensorceled on Thursday June 11, 2020 @03:31PM (#23492510)

There is no fallacy in my statement, it's an anecdote supplied to show some fairly popular, published authors are not making enough money to quit their day job. For those authors, losing income would be painful. It's an example that proves the comment I'm replying to isn't correct.

I'm not even arguing that they would lose money.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by ComputerGuru on Thursday June 11, 2020 @11:10AM (#23489693)

That’s a reply to an argument for abolishing BitTorrent, and not on-topic. What the Archive did is obviate the need to even pirate: everyone could get content “for free” from a legal entity operating under US laws and subsuming all liabilities.

Suddenly you can get your book for free without even the legal or ethical hazards.

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Re:Activists rally to save Internet Archive as lawsuit threa... by 6510 on Thursday June 11, 2020 @02:30PM (#23491851)

They are targeting their competitor.

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