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Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by aphextron on Friday April 17, 2020 @02:47PM (#22901716)
It's a completely impossible fantasy. DNA has a half life of ~500 years. Mammoths only died out around 10,000 years ago, which is why it's conceivable that one could be brought back, but all dinosaur DNA has been destroyed for millions of years.
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by credit_guy on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:34PM (#22902228)
> DNA has a half life of ~500 years

DNA is not a radioactive material. It decays, but there's no absolute law like the radioactive decay, where the half life is the same for every microgram of the same substance everywhere in the world. The average half-life may be 500 years, but there can be situations where the DNA is exceptionally well preserved due to local circumstances. As a simple analogy: the average half life of a human settlement is, let's say 50 years. That means we should see absolutely no traces of human settlements older than 2000 years (40 half-lives). That is far from true.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by londons_explore on Friday April 17, 2020 @04:42PM (#22902776)
I believe the laws of thermodynamics do set bounds on the breakdown rate of molecules at a specific temperature...

No molecule is 100% stable... Every molecular bond will break eventually due to random thermal noise...

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by andbberger on Saturday April 18, 2020 @06:12AM (#22906659)
Thermodynamics do not set any such bounds, but equilibrium statistical mechanics does describe temperature-dependent state transitions.
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by phiresky on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:19PM (#22902066)
> DNA has a half life of ~500 years

but:

Researchers in 2016 measured chloroplast DNA in marine sediment cores, and found diatom DNA dating back to 1.4 million years.[62] This DNA had a half-life significantly longer than previous research, of up to 15,000 years. Kirkpatrick's team also found that DNA only decayed along a half-life rate until about 100 thousand years, at which point it followed a slower, power-law decay rate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_DNA#Non-human_aDNA

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by hyperbovine on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:54PM (#22902384)
> and found diatom DNA dating back to 1.4 million years.

Okay, so you're 1/45th of the way there.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by BrandonM on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:06PM (#22901922)
Bringing back mammoths based only on DNA seems to me to be akin to bringing back a New Yorker based only on DNA, thousands of years after NYC no longer exists. Even with perfect DNA, I think we underestimate the role that social structure and ecological momentum play in even the simplest of creatures. I think humans are the rule and not the exception when it comes to learning after birth.

And that's not even getting into the complex interaction between a mother and her unborn child, including cytoplasm, mitochondrial RNA, etc. It's not like an organism springs whole cloth from DNA alone.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by dumbfoundded on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:20PM (#22902074)
So the culture issue you raise definitely presents some unrecoverable aspect, but as for the biology, there's certainly a path.

We have animals now that are closely enough related to extinct animals that we could conceivably bring them back through incremental genetic modifications.

For example, if we wanted to bring back Direwolves, we could edit the DNA of a gray wolf maximally such that it can still be fertile and be born by a non-edited gray wolf. This would give you a wolf closer to a Direwolf and then you could repeat this process using each previous generation as the carrying mother for the genetically modified embryo.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by londons_explore on Friday April 17, 2020 @04:29PM (#22902665)
What you say might be true, but it might not matter.

If you were to clone a New Yorker thousands of years from now and put them in an exhibit in a Zoo marked "New Yorker", lots of people would be very impressed, even if they didn't start cooking New York-style pizza.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by dmurray on Friday April 17, 2020 @04:28PM (#22902655)
> Even with perfect DNA, I think we underestimate the role that social structure and ecological momentum play in even the simplest of creatures.

I don't think that's true. We raise animals without their parents all the time, both on farms and in zoos. The animals we end up with are still recognizably horses or rats or chimpanzees, with unique behavioural traits that could be studied for years. Even if you lose the social structure of mammoth society, you would still be bringing back something fascinating.

Animals that can be hatched from eggs have even less dependency on their mothers, too.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by mod on Friday April 17, 2020 @07:50PM (#22904090)
Was going to comment similarly.

I have 16 chicks in the brooder that have never been around a chicken. They never will be around any but their 15 "siblings."

They're still acting like chickens, and they will continue throughout their lifetimes.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by nck4222 on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:38PM (#22902249)
This is explored in the book Jurassic Park, but was left out of the movie.
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by multiplegeorges on Friday April 17, 2020 @02:58PM (#22901826)
You say this as an absolute, but this very article is describing a case where it might have been found.

It's unlikely, we'll see.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by rurban on Friday April 17, 2020 @05:38PM (#22903226)
Extremely unlikely that the DNA they found is really that old. More like some recent dirt DNA.

And they tried really hard to get something out of the really good Mammoth DNA from Siberia. The blood was still liquid. No chance so far.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by grecy on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:20PM (#22902069)
Alright, let's just pretend the DNA was somehow snap frozen or preserved to make it still useable.

With today's technology could we create a creature from long ago with nothing more than it's DNA?

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by Retric on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:28PM (#22902154)
It would be a reasonable thing to attempt with today’s technology, but it would be a serious R&D project.

It’s harder the older the sample and vastly more difficult if few closely related species survive.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by thaumasiotes on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:50PM (#22902354)
> It would be a reasonable thing to attempt with today’s technology, but it would be a serious R&D project.

Dinosaurs have enough cultural prestige that it would make total sense to do it as a vanity project if the technology is there.

Similar to turning lead into gold -- there's enough cultural meaning built up around it that someone should do it before it really makes sense in a vacuum.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by stanfordkid on Friday April 17, 2020 @04:20PM (#22902588)
A project like this could be the space race of our epoch!
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by masonic on Saturday April 18, 2020 @03:55PM (#22910591)
I could see Elon Musk funding a Jurassic Park kind of effort to re-create dinosaurs... just to be the first to taste a dinosaur-egg omelette.
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by adequateness on Friday April 17, 2020 @02:53PM (#22901777)
That is what was thought but if the finding in the article turns out to be true then that might need to be reevaluated.
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by api on Friday April 17, 2020 @02:55PM (#22901797)
The key is half-life. A few fragments of dinosaur DNA surely remain, because half-life means there is a certain probability of decay over a particular unit of time. But enough to re-assemble a dinosaur? That's unlikely to the point of near-impossibility.

Even if we got really really lucky and found some that had spent most of its existence frozen deep in Antarctica or something, that would only open the potential of restoring a single dinosaur lineage and not the vast array of species depicted in Jurassic Park. That's total fantasy.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by zabeltech on Friday April 17, 2020 @02:53PM (#22901780)
What if the DNA was frozen?
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by Baeocystin on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:19PM (#22902062)
At these time scales, background radiation is the fundamental killer, and it is omnipresent in the environment.

Using numbers taken from http://news.mit.edu/1994/safe-0105 for napkin-math:

Average background dose/year: 500 millirem

LD50 instantaneous exposure: 450000 millirem

LD100 instantaneous exposure: 600000 millirem

Radiation exposure of our dinoDNA sample: 65 million * 500 = 32.5 billion millirem.

Obviously there's a lot more to it than simple dose adding, but this gives you an idea of just what deep-time DNA recovery is up against.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by hyperbovine on Friday April 17, 2020 @04:00PM (#22902423)
At least on the ancient DNA projects I've worked on, the main obstacles have been a) deamination, b) fragmentation, and c) environmental contamination. Maybe radiation enters the picture at Jurassic timescales, but the DNA would become completely degraded and worthless tens millions of years before that. Unless they somehow managed to find a dinosaur frozen at about 0K, I'm extremely skeptical of these claims.
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by brobinson on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:37PM (#22902241)
Right, but even a small amount of water (and presumably, ice) is amazing at absorbing radiation. Wouldn't something buried in a few meters of ice or more be effectively insulated from radiation?
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by Baeocystin on Friday April 17, 2020 @04:51PM (#22902865)
DNA isn't isotope free.

Like hyperbovine mentioned, there are actually other effects that come in to play far sooner, but radiation puts (an additional) hard cap on things, and is easy to napkin-math.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by TuringNYC on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:05PM (#22901907)
>> DNA has a half life of ~500 years.

Could you describe half life here? So suppose the strands are now small snippets. If you find enough, couldnt you overlap common parts and eventually re-construct the full length?

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by empath75 on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:11PM (#22901974)
It means half of the dna is destroyed every 500 years. After 65,000,000 years, you have 1/(2^130,000)th of the original DNA left, which is to say, none at all.
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by varenc on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:21PM (#22902079)
DNA half-life isn't an immutable property of the material like radioactive half-life is. The environment has an effect. The DNA in cryogenically preserved tissue should have a much longer half life.
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by TuringNYC on Friday April 17, 2020 @05:00PM (#22902932)
Curious what the half life would be for dinosaur blood within Amber (per the book)?
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by mkl on Friday April 17, 2020 @08:34PM (#22904317)
It seems to depend mostly on temperature and moisture: dry, cold, and unchanging are best. We have good DNA from Deniovans because it was recovered from bones and teeth that sat buried in a cave in Siberia for 50k years.

Being in amber might protect from moisture, but I think the temperature and temperature swings would still likely destroy it within thousands of years.

Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by fenwick67 on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:08PM (#22901943)
What about mammoths or passenger pigeons, then?
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by joyj2nd on Friday April 17, 2020 @04:37PM (#22902739)
Much easier since you can slowly morph an elephant or pidgin into a mammoth or passenger pigeon (DNA methylation etc. )
Re:Possible dinosaur DNA has been found by jhayward on Friday April 17, 2020 @03:05PM (#22901906)
> all dinosaur DNA has been destroyed for millions of years

.. Except for the DNA that has survived and been passed down to living species today.