News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by tracker1 on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:09PM (#22173556)
I mentioned this in another thread... but Mozilla/Thunderbird (not MZLA) should really concentrate more on feature-rich support. Specifically better calendar and provider integration.

Second to this, they should probably work on their own first class mail and calendar server as at least open core, and probably as SaaS as well. As much as I like some of the mail hosts out there, for some, the ability to self-host is big. The various pieces and software you have to cobble together are cumbersome, and even then, you don't get anything close to what Exchange+Outlook gives you.

It would be nice to see Thunderbird fill this space, it used to be what I would consider a best of breed email & newsgroup client, now, I'm not sure I would say anything close to that.

Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by jcranmer on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @05:04PM (#22174598)
> Second to this, they should probably work on their own first class mail and calendar server as at least open core, and probably as SaaS as well.

I quite disagree here. Servers and clients are very different in their architecture and implementation, and you are going to have very little opportunity for code reuse or even knowledge sharing between the people implementing the client and those implementing the server [1]. I don't think you can turn email servers into a profitable revenue stream unless you do full SaaS, and I don't think Mozilla is really capable of putting in the resources to make a Mozilla Email SaaS feasible.

A better bet would be to try to put together something to more effectively cobble together the existing open-source email server components and do the installation and support as a service, but I again don't think that Mozilla is the organization best-placed to provide that service.

[1] The big exception here is LDAP. But Thunderbird doesn't even really maintain its own LDAP library--it should move to WinLdap/OpenLDAP depending on OS.

Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by SahAssar on Friday January 31, 2020 @03:28PM (#22205322)
> Servers and clients are very different in their architecture and implementation

True, but also the only way to really know how to develop a good one is to have experience with building the other.

Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by samdunham on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:47PM (#22173872)
A near 100% drop-in replacement for Exchange server is kind of the holy grail of messaging/collaboration. I was looking at something that claimed to be that (or close) many, many years ago when I was doing consulting, so I could try to save my clients some money. But nothing had all of the features they wanted or was as seamless as they wanted it to be. I don't remember what the software was called, but it pre-dated Zimbra (which I think I've installed once to dink around with). I think this is more difficult now, with the move to cloud services like O365 and Google Suite. But having a self-hosted, Outlook compatible, Exchange substitute would be great.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by tracker1 on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @06:19PM (#22175270)
That has been my experience as well... these days Office365 is often the best option, with Google Docs/Gmail, Fastmail and a handful of others coming close. I'd generally favor o365 currently, but would love to see Moz deliver a great alternative. They definitely have most of the expertise to do so (even if UI/UX could use some improvements).
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by floren on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:50PM (#22173897)
> I was looking at something that claimed to be that (or close) many, many years ago when I was doing consulting, so I could try to save my clients some money. But nothing had all of the features they wanted or was as seamless as they wanted it to be. I don't remember what the software was called, but it pre-dated Zimbra

Ximian's Evolution?

Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by conception on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @04:03PM (#22173995)
Ran Zimbra for a number of years and it was fine as an exchange replacement. Only reason we moved is we wanted SaaS and didn't want to maintain it anymore.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by discreditable on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:36PM (#22173773)
I think Thunderbird resources are best spent being the best email client it can. It currently lacks mail merge support, and mapi support is bad/not-working. There is an add-on for mail merge, but as they go to webextensions its future (and that of many other add-ons) are uncertain. This affects other add-ons such as enigmail too.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by jeltz on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:42PM (#22173823)
I would like if they focused on performance and stability of current features, e.g. by improving their IMAP code and moving to SQLite storage to improve stability and fix corruption of mailboxes.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by discreditable on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @05:12PM (#22174676)
I think that would be great too. For now they seem set on maildir as the future of mail storage.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by Chirael on Wednesday January 29, 2020 @12:51AM (#22177851)
Absolutely, I agree 100%. Instead of trying to be all things to all people, I think they should stay focused on being a great email client. Based on the comments on this page it sounds like there’s certainly enough work to go around just with that goal.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by Silhouette on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:52PM (#22173911)
Second to this, they should probably work on their own first class mail and calendar server as at least open core, and probably as SaaS as well. As much as I like some of the mail hosts out there, for some, the ability to self-host is big. The various pieces and software you have to cobble together are cumbersome, and even then, you don't get anything close to what Exchange+Outlook gives you.

I would love for someone to do this, so we could have a nice, self-hosted store for our vital data but still access that data from all our devices, over VPN, etc.

The problem, as always with these things, is who that someone would be. While many HN readers might appreciate the potential advantages, I fear the target market for such a product is significantly smaller than for Thunderbird, which for better or worse is itself aiming at a relatively small minority of users in the era of Google Mail and friends.

For anything it's worth, I'd contribute financially to such a project personally and so would my businesses, since it would be a significant benefit in each case.

Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by tracker1 on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @06:24PM (#22175308)
I mostly agree... I do think it's more of an "if you build it" scenario. Thunderbird isn't big as a mail client, because there isn't the level of integration with either existing providers and/or a self-hosted option.

o365/exchange, gmail/gdocs/gcalendar and fastmail are probably the big three providers that should have seamless integration at this point. A SaaS option from Moz would be nice, as would a self-hosted option. I bring these up in line with Moz's efforts to get VPN subscribers, they could likewise do groupware.

Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by chrisseaton on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:17PM (#22173613)
> MZLA

Why's Mozilla got a stock ticker if it isn't publicly traded?

Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by komon on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:24PM (#22173673)
It doesn't, that's the name of the corporation taking over maintenance of Thunderbird listed in the article.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by chrisseaton on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:29PM (#22173723)
Oh right - but I looked up https://stocktwits.com/symbol/MZLA and it's from 2010 so I don't know if that's the new company but it says Mozilla.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by dna_polymerase on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @04:57PM (#22174521)
Given that this is Stocktwits, I assume the page you linked was auto-generated after enough people used the cashtag ($-followed by Symbol) on Twitter.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by jszymborski on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:23PM (#22173669)
It's the name of the new company meant to steward Thunderbird according to the post.
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by phonon on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:34PM (#22173762)
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by tracker1 on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @06:21PM (#22175283)
I have in the past... now how/where do I sync this calendar, and does it allow me to share read-only data with other people?
Re:Thunderbird’s New Home by jszymborski on Tuesday January 28, 2020 @03:23PM (#22173659)
I really like that second idea, although it might be more productive as a partnership with an existing solution like Open-Xchange, Zimbra, or Citadel.