London has had 10,000's of mini-cabs for decades that served a big chunk of this non-Black cab market. They weren't perfect but they were cheap, pretty ubiquitous and served most (if not all) of the spaces left in the market by black cabs.

So Uber as a service hasn't been that revolutionary in London, the things they HAVE done is improve the ordering UX and making CC's ubiquitous.

`So Uber as a service hasn't been that revolutionary in London, the things they HAVE done is improve the ordering UX and making CC's ubiquitous.` - the daily trip volumes tell a different story and clearly show there's an impact.

nm

That's a questionable dichotomy considering there's ample research showing Uber is cannibalizing public transit and regulations on Taxis have historically been put in place for a variety of reasons that one should at least consider.

Nobody denies that people like Uber for reasons but what does it even mean for a Taxi system to suck when compared to a super exploitative, unregulated enterprise such as this? As a driver, this is not only about compensation. It's about a critical lack of security in all aspects of your life. And if, as a passenger, you can't really afford decent service and working conditions maybe you are trying to live beyond your means and you should really be boarding a train or bus instead. And if you can't, that, to me, seems like a political problem that shouldn't be solved on the backs of some of the most vulnerable sectors of society.

According to what I witness in the current comments, a first step for taxis would be to mandate a working credit card machine, under penalties.

However, it seems so many many taxis were frauding their taxes, that it became cultural and enforced.

Which means taxis, which are already known as the top thief job in the world, also steal the citizen on a third level after the ride itself and after choosing the night rate at noon: taxes.

I dare to say Uber, as bad as they can ever be with wages under the legal minimum, can still be a better behaved citizen.

Taxes aren't theft. Taxes is when we as a society pool together resources to invest into the projects we as a society agreed to implement by means of the democratic process. If you don't like it you can organize and pick different projects or fewer of them or create a system that doesn't have taxes. Taxi drivers have nothing to do with it.

I believe that GP is saying that not paying taxes is theft from society.

Oooh...

London it's really not bad in my somewhat limited experience. (Usually take transit.) Yes it's more expensive than VC-subsidized rides but is better than taxis in most places.

Black cabs only work in the center, even in Zone 2 there are plenty places where you won't find one and where they won't be willing to go.

Car hire can work but it's often more expensive, needs to be booked ahead of time and they also refuse trips that aren't profitable for them.

Uber openen up travel for many people in London, especially at night. It's quite easy to find a lot of places in London that aren't serviced by Night Buses, there are plenty of places that are 15-30 min walk from a tube station, and the Night Tube is only available on select lines and only during the weekend.

> Black cabs only work in the center

They're bad in the center too. I live in London bridge / SE1 and black cabs still illegally refuse to take me home from say, Shoreditch because they can't be bothered crossing the river.

"nah mate, don't go sarf of the river, me"

There are also minicabs everywhere, some of which have app-based booking, and Uber certainly isn't the only rideshare app Londoners can use.

The black cabs in London were excellent but ridiculously expensive, which is why I’ve only caught one, like, once. Most people have to rely on minicabs, which were sketchy and unreliable. Uber was a huge boon to London.

Black cabs in the city are excellent, try hailing a black cab from anywhere not within 5-10 min walking from a major transportation hub like Pad, KingsX, Victoria, Euston and outside of the City's financial bubble.

The OP literally said it was excellent. But expensive. What is your point?

That they service only a minuscule part of London and refuse to take rides that take them outside of it.

Even in the center good luck hailing one at 2am on a Saturday night.

I’ve been refused rides form the Shard, Bank, and Canary Wharf plto Lancaster gate, both of which are in Zone 1.

If I want to hail a cab from my home I have to walk 10 min to Paddington and I live essentially across from Hyde Park which makes me considerably more central than most people in London.

For my friends who live in Hammersmith, Fulham, Acton and Chiswick they might as well be living in Belgium as far as black cabs are concerned they don’t go there and they won’t take you there.

I mostly lived in London just before Uber.

I don't know if they still do, but many nightclubs would have some arrangement where there was someone from a minicab company in the lobby or just outside. You'd say "W3", he'd say "That'll be £20, in 10 minutes time" and you could wait in the warm until the car arrived. (Of course, if you knew a number for a different company, you could phone them yourself.)

The drivers were pretty clueless -- even a fairly large inner-London station name like "Ealing Broadway" would frequently be misunderstood, and they'd want to slowly type a postcode into a satnav -- but otherwise they were OK.

The Taxi system still sucks often. I take cabs when I'm in downtown Chicago once in a while because they are faster than waiting for an uber. Recently I was wearing a tie-dye shirt and joggers (leaving the climbing gym) and it took me 5 minutes to flag down a cab even though plenty of empty ones passed me. I've never had an issue in the past with being picked up and it was clearly related to my state of dress. Cabs suck.

That's quite an amusing story! Perhaps cabs are the new fashion police?

On the German city where I live, they are pretty alright.

Prices are ridiculous, though, compared to England (except London)!

Spaniard here. They also work quite well in Spain.

> But does everyone remember how much the Taxi system sucked?

In London? The suckage level was zero. Black cabs were fine. Reputable minicabs (Addison Lee etc.) were fine. Uber does not provide anything like enough improvement to justify the level of illegality it's riddled with.

I think having a system that prevents drivers from pretending they can't take credit cards, and automates the process of picking people up is extremely valuable. But I wish the capital subsidy would go away so that the market could become more rational and sustainable. And the last few times I've taken an Uber or a Lyft (to/from picking up my car for repairs) the driver has...not kept a hand on the wheel at all times. So, I'm all for regulation, but the app(s) themselves are a kind of regulation that was sorely needed.

I remember calling my local minicab company and usually getting a ride in 10 or 15 minutes. Or grabbing a black cab. Never used Uber.

I still take yellow cabs home from JFK & LGA airports. The process of getting a Lyft or Uber is miserable, while I can virtually get straight into a yellow cab, even when there’s a line at the taxi stand.

Just recently I took a bus at LGA that takes you from the tetminal to the taxi stand due to construction. Even this was easier than getting a Lyft or Uber. I was in the cab way faster (including bus ride) much faster than if I trek to the designated ride hailing pickup areas and negotiate the sea of traffic to find my driver (even in less busy hours).

To boot, the cab trip started further from the airport due to the bus ride, so we were out of airport’s immediate dropoff traffic right away.

Ride was ~$10 cheaper than Lyft as well. The only downside was the annoying TV embedded in the cab. I muted it but could not power off the display.

The usual Uber/Lyft booking/pickup system doesn't scale well at airports where personal car pickup/dropoff is already a real mess in many cases. Some airports are trying to deal with this by moving ride-share to a different area (e.g. Central Parking in Boston) which is less convenient for passengers, especially those that don't know the airport well.

Usually I just take a taxi from the airport if there isn't a good transit option available. (Or book a car service in advance at my home airport.)